Bare Metal, Now What?

[AirJose]

I am stripping all the coats of paint to bare metal using aircraft stripper. Now, Do I use etching primer? or use use metal 2 metal and then the etching primer? and how should I clean the bare metal in case some stripper is still in the metal. Thanks to all!

[hillbilly]

Read the instructions.....most recomend flushing with water. I personaly would give it a good scrub with warm water and baking soda using a scotch bright pad.( red one)after flushing this will neutralize any of the caustic chemicals. Then dry it real well With air or if you dont have that use a heat gun on any crevases or seams.Then sand the panels with a say 120 grit paper( you could use 100 or 80 if doing by hand, this is metal and your not to worried about sand scratches) Claen wth a wax and grease remover and then, apply your etch primer, dont use a lot of it, a thin coat is all you need ...more is not better in this case, then apply your high solids primer. Don't cheap out on the primer as it is the foundation of your paint job...... have fun......

[AirJose]

Great! So I am assuming that any filler should be applied after cleaning the metal and before the etching primer. Or can I apply the filler after the etching primer? Thanks

[hillbilly]

You can put your filler over your etch primer.You could also use an epoxy primmer and fill over that..as long as you fill within 24 hours.This would be the way to go.When you sand your filler you may (will ) break through the primer so put a little more on your bare metal.This can be done with a brush.Then refill.Epoxy is a little harder to sand but is well worth the extra work.you could epoxy then fill then use another high fill primer on top of that.) using epoxy for your base and to seal your filler.....that would be the 2nd best way to go.....have fun.....Bill.

[doc]

hillbilly's advice is right on, I think. But since you have it to bare metal, I'd work hard to do the bodywork so that no filler is necessary. If you can get the metal pretty close, which is just not that hard with a little patience (most cases), you can use the high build primer or several coats of same to get a smooth surface to paint. Might take just a little longer this way, but you've already taken a lot of trouble. Why not go all the way?

[Louis D]

Lots of bodymen say to use filler on bare metal before the etching primer and some say after. i guess it's up to the user.

[Phil Smith]

Obviously you can see that there is more then one way to do this, but depending on the extreme of the body work depends on how I'd do the process. If you have just dents and no cutting and welding in new panels:

1. then after you have stripped it I'd clean it with grease/wax remover which can be found at any auto paint store.

2. Do the bodywork, hammering/shaping and minimal fill (expensive but I use a filler called "ALL-METAL" on the bare surfaces)

3. Then I'd place a coat of high build primer and a "shadow coat" (very thin mist of primer that is most opposite color black/white) The shadow coat shows you high and low spots when sanding. When the shadow coat is gone you'll now how straight it is. Also, when sanding down dents filled with filler sand with a long block in a X pattern.

Once it's straight definitely go with an epoxy or sealer

With my Ghia I have a lot of welding to do so once I strip it, it will be blasted and sprayed in an expoxy, mainly because I have about a month of welding to do.

Depending on what epoxy you use I believe you have more then 24 hours to put the filler on. A primer to think about using is called Covol primer which is a catalyst primer that allows you to use body filler over it because the two are very similiar. It's been nicknamed sprayable bondo. It is a very high quality primer so don't let the nickname scare you. The stuff is stronger than rock and is tough as hell to sand.

Hope this helps

[AirJose]

Thanks to All for your responses! It is great info. I will follow your advice in cleaning and doing the bodywork. I will work a panel at a time and then spray with etch primer. Can I use the preval sprayer for the etch primer or I do I have to buy a spray gun? Thanks again, Jose

[doc]

Some good stuff from Phil above. He mentions the "shadow coat" or "guide coat" technique which is a big trick.

After the high build primer, use an opposite color - just cheap spray can paint is ok, since you're going to sand it all off - and just "sputter" it on the panel you are working, making it look like the part has the measles. The way I learned was to then wrap a piece of sandpaper around a paint stir stick - 12" long, flat piece of wood - and then sand the piece in an x pattern. Sanding in an x pattern - first up one side of the x, then along the other side of the x - keeps you from sanding grooves in the piece. Because the stick is 12" long, it causes you to sand flat and not create waves. You could use a shorter sanding stick,e.g. 6", if the piece warrants. But the point is that the stick keeps you honest - FLAT. As you sand, you will see that the guide coat gets sanded away - except low spots. Keep sanding until all the guide coat is gone. Respray with high build primer, if necessary, i.e., when you sand a bare metal ring around a low spot without getting all the way down to the guide coat. Maybe bump out that low spot a little. High spots quickly sand through to bare metal. Work with progressively finer sandpaper and reprime where you sand through the high spots after you hammer them "down" a little. You may have to go through the whole process several times to get the piece right.

Using this method, remarkable results can be achieved with patience. This is the method the show car guys use for those remarkable paint jobs. This work is 90% of getting a great paint job.

[Phil Smith]

Thanks Doc for the comment, the "guide coat" is a very good tool and I think everyone should use it especially amatuers. Its a very easy process because it shows you exactly what is going on.

Auto paint stores should sell the long block sanders, but similiar to Doc I use a 1 by 2 piece of wood about 12 inches long and just roll it up in sand paper.

Another tool you may want to buy is a slide hammer. Basically it welds itself to the body at the dent with a rod and then the slide hammer knocks out of the dent. The weld comes off easily.

Also another trick, when feeling the car for dents or flatness dont just use your bare hand, get a thin rag or paper towel and then feel the car. You'll be amazed how much more you can tell from this method.