944 disc brake to Splitty Retro-fit??

aircooledtechguy · Post by **aircooledtechguy** » Sat Jun 01, 2002 6:35 am

I've got a '66 E-Z Camper that is stock height and would like to keep it that way. I want better braking especially since the stock drums leave a lot to be desired when I've got a roof rack and trailer full of stuff

I've heard of folks saying that you can use Porsche 944 brakes. . . Is this fact or fiction and what would I have to do to fit a set for the front on?? How about the rears?? This interests me because a local wrecking yard that I go to, and get GREAT deals on stuff at, has a 944 with complete brakes and wheels. So it could be an economical upgrade for me. Any info on this is appreciated.

------------------
Regards,

Nate Morse
Owner, Nate's WaterArt:
www.nateswaterart.com

Nate's Air-Cooled VW Tech Pages:
www.nateswaterart.com/vw/

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Sat Jun 01, 2002 12:03 pm

Doing the front swap is straight forward if you use the kit (or parts of it) from Old Speed. I think Pillow has the cost down to ~$300 for the parts of theirs that he needed. That is in addition to the parts he sourced from a junkyard and Pelican Parts. You will need to change the master cylinder as well. If you are only doing the front disk swap them a '71-'79 bay window dual circuit master cylinder should do the trick. Wolfgang has a $40 adapter kit for that. If you really want the rear disks as well then the 944 master cylinder is a ready choice since it was designed for the calipers you would use.

Call me crazy but I am looking into doing the rear swap on my '65 as well. It's not very straightforward and some modification of the RGB outside cover is necessary. This is definitely a mod that is best done to spare parts, as it will be difficult to re-mount the wheel cylinder if you want to go back to stock. I have already started mocking up parts using an extra outside RGB cover

One thing that does concern me however is that if the rear seal leaks then the RGB oil will get all over the brakes and cause major problems. In the stock bus design there are drain holes that direct any leakage to the outside of the backing plate thus keeping the oil off the shoes.

Thomas

[This message has been edited by Single Cab (edited 06-01-2002).]

Pillow · Post by **Pillow** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 7:42 am

Thanks Thomas, I do not even have to post anymore

LOL

I should be getting the rest of the kit from Old Speed this week! There are a couple parts that are custom that must be purchased from Old Speed like calipers mounts, bearing spacers, and grease caps.

Also there are a handful of other items you will need on hand as well, but Thomas hit all the main points.

The front 944 calipers I am using are from a 83-85.5(86?) 944. If you go to the later 4 pot system I am not sure how it will fit on.

This is not a cheap conversion! Once you add in wheels(Fuchs), tires, rebuild stuff, bearings, shocks, blah blah blah... You will basically be at about $1000 just for the front axle, plus or minus of course. I think it will be worth it big time, but I drive my bus a lot so better braking is worth its weight in gold.

The rear is tricky... Thomas let me know how your experiment turns out! Sounds very interesting, I thought the RGBs would be to restrictive to get the 944 brakes on there? My initial plan is to get a T1 tranny and do the IRS conversion. With this you pick up T1/T3 rear brakes which are very easily swapped to the 944 rears. The trick is keeping it stock height which is important to me.

Actually I think once the front brakes are done I will focus on CIS FI conversion (regular 1600) for a while and then get back to the rear end issues this fall.

------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'67 VW Deluxe Westfakia - "Dino"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 12:29 pm

So far the only issue is with the 25mm extra width per side. At this time it is unclear whether I'll be able to fit a rim under there. I have done the first bit of machining to get the caliper mount to mate up with the RGB. I need to get a stepped collar made to register the two together as well as keep the RGB outer bearing?s outer race from moving about but that should be simple enough. If I can get a rim to fit under the arch then it all looks good from there but if not then I'll have to play around to see if it is feasible. Adrian, what size Fuchs are you going to use?.

Thomas

Pillow · Post by **Pillow** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 1:17 pm

Very interesting Thomas! Keep me posted, I may follow in your footsteps

I am running 15"x6" Fuchs.

... The problem is that I want to run 215/75/R15 tires in the rear, which is impossible with adaptor plates (too much width and hits fender).

I still need to harass Old Speed and see how thier stock height IRS kit works.

From what I gather the trick to the stock height is using Thing control arms instead of the Beetle control arms. Anyone have some Thing control arms on the cheap??? I did not think so

------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'67 VW Deluxe Westfakia - "Dino"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"

Plasticfantastic · Post by **Plasticfantastic** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 4:25 pm

Did you guys see the July issue of Hot VW's ? Page 79. Blue 21 window with 993 drivetrain????
You can see the big reds through the wheels and those are 18" factory 996's its rolling on.
Anybody know any details on this bus????

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 10:19 pm

Pillow,

Are you running those Fuchs now or plan to when you do the front brakes?

Thomas

paul_f · Post by **paul_f** » Tue Jun 04, 2002 5:01 am

Does the 944 master cylinder fit as easily as the bay window dual circuit master cylinder?
Has anyone managed to fit power brakes/ a brake servo to their split?
Cheers
Paul

Pillow · Post by **Pillow** » Tue Jun 04, 2002 5:52 am

Hey Thomas,

I am running EMPI adapters in the rear for now... The adapters suck ass! I should return them. The dang things do not even fit on a T2.

The front is stock until I do the brake conversion. Then I will add the Fuchs.

The 993 21-window is crazy. I question the sanity of anyone putting $100K into thier bus. Kind of cool, but kind of stupid at the same time.

The 944 MC should be a drop in fit, at least that is the way it looks and others have claimed doing it. Granted only use this MC with 4 wheel discs.

I have not explored power brakes at all, so I have no idea if it is possible. Personally I would rather not have power brakes.

------------------
Adrian Pillow
'66 VW Westfalia - "Biscuit"
'67 VW Deluxe Westfakia - "Dino"
'79 Porsche 911 SC - "Cochese"

panel · Post by **panel** » Tue Jun 04, 2002 7:48 pm

I'm running a copy of the Old Speed kit but use a single 912 disk and late bus calipers.I also use the 944 hubs though and made my own caliper mounts.S/S lines are also nice while you're under there might as well!

------------------
My turbo 1600cc split window bus page

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Tue Jun 04, 2002 11:12 pm

I have read that someone had power brakes using a late bus beam in a split. Seems like a lot of work but then maybe it's worth it. I guess it all depends on how stiff you like your brake pedal to feel. Micheal Ghia has added a power servo to his car too so it can be done with some modification and patience

I have lined up a complete axle with RGB for testing out my 944 mod to see if it is doable. Only bummer is that I can't get it until sometime next week

Thomas

SlammedBay · Post by **SlammedBay** » Wed Jun 05, 2002 12:05 am

Would anyone be able to post the dimensions of the caliper bracket for the front 944 brake conversions and also info on the bearing spacer?

Many Thanks

Ollie

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Wed Jun 05, 2002 1:36 am

SlammedBay,

Check the hipo news and reviews as there is a 944 disk conversion thread with the dimensions you seek.

Thomas

SlammedBay · Post by **SlammedBay** » Wed Jun 05, 2002 5:36 am

Did not see the dimensions for the 944 caliper mount for a split bus, only beetles!

Any help greatfully recieved!

Single Cab · Post by **Single Cab** » Wed Jun 05, 2002 9:30 am

Oh yeah, sorry about that. I don't think the bus dimensions have been published. Old Speed has come up with a design so maybe we can talk Pillow into measuring the ones he is getting

Thomas