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So Clone posted something about a leak in his butterfly shaft, and I was thinking about the stupid TB I have to buy for my jetski which is drive by wire and it got me thinking. Why doesn't anyone use the drive by wire design? I don't hear of failures in them and at least the one I've seen they don't have a shaft coming out that surely always has to leak some.

I think a throttle cable is much easier than all the extra wiring for pedal sensors, stepper motor on the TB and the electonics that control them.

Just my 0.02$

Someone was installing one on a VW but it never got updated......If I remember correctly there are a couple out there but as said.......The complication is hardly worth it for a street driver.
For someone like Chip that would want traction control for per gear boost control it might be worth it since the computer could control the throttle and the boost for best traction but overall......you would need a good computer.
"Fail Safes" and the liability on the road would be something you would need to take into account on a daily driver.

People played with the hydraulic throttle pedal at one time too; it reacted slower than was wanted even with strong springs which also increased the needed pedal pressure.

Just a guess here but there is that possibly you could get the same loss of "feel" from an electrical throttle; e.g., the "feel" you get from the manual/cable throttle (unless you are wearing ski boots of course) could be lost. I know that where I ride pedal "feel" and "reaction time" (you know like that "dead spot" in a carb) are both very important.

Lee

buguy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 4:51 am I don't hear of failures in them and at least the one I've seen they don't have a shaft coming out that surely always has to leak some.

They still have a throttle plate and shaft. It is controlled by a motor rather than a cable/linkage.

For an engine to not have a throttle plate it is either diesel, or has variable lift and duration of the valves in order to throttle the engine.

Steve Arndt wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:39 am

buguy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 4:51 am I don't hear of failures in them and at least the one I've seen they don't have a shaft coming out that surely always has to leak some.

They still have a throttle plate and shaft. It is controlled by a motor rather than a cable/linkage.

For an engine to not have a throttle plate it is either diesel, or has variable lift and duration of the valves in order to throttle the engine.

I think Buguy meant that the shaft doesn't come out of the housing due to the drive motor sealing that end......It could possibly still leak internally though.

I guess you just have to add a bigger turbo.......

Yeah I didn't think of it leaking internally. But I'm all for adding a bigger turbo.
I was just reading the mouse thread where kalle made 222 HP on 1 bar. That's impressive! Has to be that big turbo

buguy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:08 am Yeah I didn't think of it leaking internally. But I'm all for adding a bigger turbo.
I was just reading the mouse thread where kalle made 222 HP on 1 bar. That's impressive! Has to be that big turbo

E85

.550" valve lift...

2 Inch or larger intake tubes.......And a large turbo.

That would mean that engine would have to be putting out 110 hp to the wheels N/A. That's some pretty decent flow.........

Mine does 112 whp at 6.0 lbs boost.

Yeah. I never saw anywhere that mentioned his compression ratio either. I can't imagine it was low like ours. Only give away I remember was 5.6" rods.

On the drive by wire front on a stock application they are great allows easy use of things like cruise control etc, on an aftermarket application there are a few ECUs that support it now but I have always preferred a cable due to the simplicity of it, on the traction control side of it I have always used timing to control it rather than trying to reduce boost pressure as you can knock alot of timing out which will kill power ~instantly and maintain the boost so as the timing is bought back in you have the same power rather than waiting for the turbo to spool again.

Yeah I was just reading about MS3 and the timing retard on launch. I didn't see exactly how it worked. If it was a time thing or rpm related or what. Pretty cool stuff though.

Clonebug wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:54 pm

buguy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:08 am Yeah I didn't think of it leaking internally. But I'm all for adding a bigger turbo.
I was just reading the mouse thread where kalle made 222 HP on 1 bar. That's impressive! Has to be that big turbo

E85

.550" valve lift...

2 Inch or larger intake tubes.......And a large turbo.

That would mean that engine would have to be putting out 110 hp to the wheels N/A. That's some pretty decent flow.........

Mine does 112 whp at 6.0 lbs boost.

Kalle could shine some more light in regards to specs, but as far as I recall;
1641
40/35 cb heads
Custom mild jpm cam
1,6 rockers
2x 52mm (?) single tbs
Big PWR intercooler
2,5’’ intake tubes
1 3/4 exhaust
Custom precision turbo

Sounds right. I think I remember him saying he was at about 7500rpm redline.