Hybrid Engine Project

iswinkels · Post by **iswinkels** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 9:01 pm

The heads have a great deal of aluminium around the edges which allowd me to drill and tap threads into them. I then screwed and loctited studs into them and then bolt the plates down to those studs.

As for the heads studs, they are 12mm with a 1mm pitch on them. Subaru's are the same from factory. Each bolt could hold upwards of 80ft-lb. I dont know what subaru torque them too, but they have to clamp a flat head gasket down to a specific pressure so considering the surface area for sealing id imagine its a lot.

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:31 am

Planning on sealing the plate to the head with Silicone ?

I'm guessing it would be enough,it only has to seal the pressure in the cooling system.

iswinkels · Post by **iswinkels** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:35 am

There's 6 bolts and yes its glued on with ultra grey.

This particular build of the engine was only going to run for 15 minutes or so. If it all worked out it gets stripped and the modifications to the case become more perminent. Lifter bores blocked, camshaft removed, external oil pump, custom pistons with valve pockets machined in to allow a closer deck etc...

Still, its a fair ways off completion. Trying to finish other projects first.

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:16 am

I'm thinking this idea might be an option for a Bonneville LSR project.

Probably starting out with a Type 5 converted to an Oxyboxer,
with aftermarket Type 1 heads.

But I'm thinking 4 valve water cooled heads offer more potential,
especially in the blown classes.

Post by **Piledriver** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:09 pm

The 2.5s have a 99mm bore stock...
Should be able to go 101.6 easy.

Bigger valves/ports/etc.

(What's the max size for that class again?)

iswinkels · Post by **iswinkels** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:50 pm

The downside is the EJ20T heads are 55cc combustion chambers and you cant exactly go increasing on that. The only way to lower the compression and retain a close deck is to run a dished piston. Which isnt a bad thing considering you can then run no valve-piston interference.

Post by **Piledriver** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:19 pm

101.6x61.5 stroke, long rod ratio... 2.0 (land speed record mill)

With OHC and the right springs/valves etc (and a pressure die cast 6016T6 block/all T4 mains sandwiched between 1/2" steel plates) I would venture 12K+ would not be impossible, esp if one could swing a pneumatic valve spring setup... (if legal)

Boost at 12K would probably provide sufficient HP w/o unmanageable cylinder pressure.

Happen to know the chamber size on EJ25 heads?

OTOH it would probably be more sensible to destroke an EJ25 crank, cut the deck to the height you want and go.
(I'm sure I have omitted a couple of steps

)

OTOH that probably wouldn't be class legal at all.

IITC Jim Fueling pushed the Ecotecs direct (weaker) ancestor (the Quad4) to something like 1200 HP on a stock bottom end for LSR duties.

I wonder if an Ecotec would fit in a Miata...

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:49 pm

2015cc for G.Motors are open to ANY mods.
Swapping heads,destroking motors,no problem.

Different classes for Gas,Fuel,Blown Gas,Blown Fuel.

We turned over 10,000 with a 2 liter hart motor around 20 years ago.

If the V8 drag race the Nascar crowd can do 10,000 with much larger valves,
then it should be a case of finding good springs.And changing them frequently.

Post by **Piledriver** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:38 pm

Pneumatic.

Better, and in the long run probably cheaper.

I'm still sorta surprised no one has tooled up some for standard apps to sell, probably because they are illegal already in most classes.

(Frequently so were ceramic lifters, IMHO, those 2 techs would have probably SAVED racers money in the long haul. Imagine the savings if Pro-Stock was allowed to run Pneumatics...)

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:00 pm

The price won't come down,until the volume goes up.

And (in some classes) they won't be legal,until the price comes down.

Catch 22.

Post by **Piledriver** » Sat Aug 25, 2007 9:54 pm

Unkl Ian wrote:I'm thinking this idea might be an option for a Bonneville LSR project.

Probably starting out with a Type 5 converted to an Oxyboxer,
with aftermarket Type 1 heads.

But I'm thinking 4 valve water cooled heads offer more potential,
especially in the blown classes.

Off topic, but thinking out loud...

Warped thought, if the class is truly unlimited...

Bolt a pair of GSXR 1000 motors together, and maybe boost it.

350 HP NA from 2L would be a gimme, as that's ~stock output X2 @~13K and I'm sure there are a few with decent engines and broke frames...

(They do it to their bigger brother all the time, some nutcase;-) has a pair of blown `Busas in the middle of an Ultima set up with AWD... North of 1100 HP, street driven (for some insane definition of "street" I'm sure)

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 6:22 pm

Multiple motors are only legal in Lakester and Streamliner.

We were considering running Competition Coupe.
I figured the competition is a little softer.Being able to
start with a real car would get the project rolling sooner,
and make it easier to squeeze everything in there.

Some guy in a Honda figured the same thing
and bumped the Bonneville records around 10mph.

To use the bike motor power,you'd have to put two
of them together to create one motor,in /CC.
Like they did on the old Sesco V8 Midget motors.
A little bit of work,to make it run hard and live.

I don't know exactly how they would define what is one or two motors.

The way things are going,the new bike motors
are going to dominate all the lower classes.

Post by **Piledriver** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 8:55 pm

Unkl Ian wrote:Multiple motors are only legal in Lakester and Streamliner.

We were considering running Competition Coupe.
I figured the competition is a little softer.Being able to
start with a real car would get the project rolling sooner,
and make it easier to squeeze everything in there.

Some guy in a Honda figured the same thing
and bumped the Bonneville records around 10mph.

To use the bike motor power,you'd have to put two
of them together to create one motor,in /CC.
Like they did on the old Sesco V8 Midget motors.
A little bit of work,to make it run hard and live.

I don't know exactly how they would define what is one or two motors.

The way things are going,the new bike motors
are going to dominate all the lower classes.

Might be interesting to find out...
One clutch, one tranny...

Other "easy" option is just run the 1500 class with a bored out `busa motor, ~200HP without much effort, 240+ likely possible. (blown, double that +)

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:33 pm

Something tells me those bike motors are fragile
when you REALLY start leaning on them.

A Honda car motor,destroked down to 1500,then turboed,
would probably be more reliable.Dart makes a better block,with good liners,and taller deck height so you can run longer rods.

Larry Widmer gets almost 300 hp for his NA 2 liter Honda street/strip motors.

The crazy HP # seen in the sport compact drag racing will show up in LSR soon.

kwickist · Post by **kwickist** » Thu Oct 04, 2007 6:31 pm

can you two "get a room"

this thread was/is extremly interesting............ up until about 8 posts ago:twisted: bring it on Ian fantastic work