are empi 3/4" sway bars worth the money?

[juki48]

well I finally got to installing the front bar. It really didn't want to fit any way but stock. on top of the lower arms hit the beam, on the top arms it hit the body. so I just installed them the way it is supposed to be. it was an easy install. I did use the SS clamps and put the screws on the back side. those clams give me a little more wheel clearance than the stock style so I'm better than I was. What a difference that bar makes! the car really handles nicely. I want to get some driving time in on the front bar before I mess with the rear so I can really feel how it changes.

[mountainkowboy]

Good to know, I want to make my 71 a carver.

[andy198712]

well I finally got to installing the front bar. It really didn't want to fit any way but stock. on top of the lower arms hit the beam, on the top arms it hit the body. so I just installed them the way it is supposed to be. it was an easy install. I did use the SS clamps and put the screws on the back side. those clams give me a little more wheel clearance than the stock style so I'm better than I was. What a difference that bar makes! the car really handles nicely. I want to get some driving time in on the front bar before I mess with the rear so I can really feel how it changes.

yeah its mad isn't it! really chuckable i found, its just goes where you point it, well the front does

[buildabiggerboxer]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/27pd6xuvq1ihz ... .28.55.jpg
Here's my 20mm adjustable tubular bar on my circuit car, mounted Porsche style, it's reached the end of it's useful life, it's in the way of further diffusor development and it's too low, it grounds out, so I'm moving to an over slung setup Inside the car, it will run in a tube to skirt a ban on inboard suspension hardware. The front one is similar to the whitline bar, I will post a pic after I've shrunk it....

[andy198712]

How do you combat the over steer in wet when you update the front roll bar? Better tyres?

Are those sheets bolted to your pans? Better aero? Nice

[buildabiggerboxer]

Andy, Oversteer in rain is the holly grail! We have to go look for more usually, depends on the base set up of the car, tho most are dynamically similar no matter what make or spec, front or rear engine, it's the front that goes away first, especially now we have some more understeer from increased rear loads via the Venturi effect, oddly, I just had a rain blessed sprint event at the Apex festival a month ago, we disconnect the front bar and shifted brake bias to the rear, given time, I may play with tyre pressures. This on the race track remember. The under panels come off easily, they are bolt on, every thing is test and research and changes monthly, that means cheap and cheerfull until the design is proofed and working as intended. Road tyres these days have enormous wet grip, i use some now deleted Bridgestone RE720 as rain tyres, fabulous, but I used dry tyres on the rear in the sprint to good effect, Bridgestones just on the front. Regards, BBB.

20mm adjustable front bar, high mounted for kerb straddling. https://www.dropbox.com/s/s7xe9hmxci59q ... %20009.jpg

[andy198712]

it wasn't on a damp road when i wasn't expecting it shortly after fitting the bar and CC just adjusted my driving style around it, maybe i was driving faster due to the HD roll bar and learnt the hard way...
still unsure of what tyres i want next, i don't mind milage but some prices are silly well, its relevant to the use i guess mind!

nice looking bar! what shocks are they?

[buildabiggerboxer]

The shoxs are GasSpax, here we await the start of last months wet qualifying runs early on the Saturday, the Sunday was hot and dry! https://www.dropbox.com/s/o5c86mjnmkn32 ... 386845.jpg

[helowrench]

it wasn't on a damp road when i wasn't expecting it shortly after fitting the bar and CC just adjusted my driving style around it, maybe i was driving faster due to the HD roll bar and learnt the hard way...
still unsure of what tyres i want next, i don't mind milage but some prices are silly well, its relevant to the use i guess mind!

nice looking bar! what shocks are they?

I just installed 4ea 205/60-25 Ohtsu on Mahle 914 4lugs.

fit perfectly, but I will be adding a 5mm spacer to regain some turning radius, I think.
what I had found to be the limits on old hard tires, is now gone. I have yet to reach the new limits.
NOTE: I did find that the Ohtsus are very squirmy at 22psi front and 25 rear. At 25 front and 29 rear the ey feel solid, and no loss of braking.
I have yet to make a tire squeal in either cornering or braking.

[buildabiggerboxer]

it wasn't on a damp road when i wasn't expecting it shortly after fitting the bar and CC just adjusted my driving style around it, maybe i was driving faster due to the HD roll bar and learnt the hard way...
still unsure of what tyres i want next, i don't mind milage but some prices are silly well, its relevant to the use i guess mind!

nice looking bar! what shocks are they?

Oversteer in the dry with a camber compensator,? Very Unusual, These promote understeer in cornering, but there are so many other variables in chassis set up, you may have toe out on the rear, un suitable tyre pressures or unbalanced corner weights. Sounds like a good set up session is required, the wet reveals the weakest link on any vehicle, the steering grip factor, an over steering car soon turns into an under steerer in the rain, exaggerated even more for examples sake on snow or ice, were it can just mean no direction change at all, a stiff and bared up car is all but useless.
I quick little tale as it's BGP Silverstone w/end, I was on my way to the circuit VERY Early one morning in a well known performance 4wd car, driving quick when I could, within the law and speed limits when it was prudent, and WELL reserved down the narrow lanes, it's Harvest time, yes TRACTORS suddenly pulling out of fields,,, Now I have a Porsche behind, close and being stupid and lamp flashing, soon as it's down to A 50 limit , he floors it at about 80!! No worries to me, he's gone, 1/2 hour later it's hissing down, the Porsche came to me suddenly, all the bravado gone, I can see now it's all barred up and low, rock solid suspension too, it's all over the place in the rain. My turn to go!! I never saw him again, the moral is not to bias a road car to much too all out track type suspension, just enjoy a good up grade with the best all round tyres you can run too. Regards BBB.

[Jprather]

The upper arms lack the bumps which help to keep the clamps from sliding out of place. Space is tight with a full body, too...so it's not a particularly elegant approach, but it can be made to work.
The point of the "lowered" bar is that it's shaped differently so as to not hang as low when the control arms are angled as they are when using torsion bar adjuster to lower the front end. With drop spindles the control arms remain at the stock angle, so it's not an issue to run the "standard" shaped bar.
Many rear bars mount to the frame horns using squared-off U-bolts which you poke up and dangle down through two holes drilled in the bottom of the horn...I've seen these holes become stress risers causing frame horns to crack, so I prefer to use mounts which clamp around the horns instead. But IMO a ¾" rear bar is a bit much for a street car anyway.
Have you looked at the rear swaybar setup used on the 924/944 Porsches? Theirs are routed forward and avoid the frame horn mounts altogether. You fabricate some brackets which attach by U-bolts to the rear torsion housing, looking similar to these:

Hello Marc,
I found these clamps at Pelican Parts. Do you have any pics of how they work? What other hardware would I need to install a 944 rear sway? I am interested in the 14mm unit. My car is also a street vehicle. I am slowly trying to improve the handling of my street Baja. Thanks for your advice.

[Bruce.m]

Genuine 944 brackets for mounting to the torsion tube however, they need welding on differently to fit under the forks (& bracing).

[andy198712]

it wasn't on a damp road when i wasn't expecting it shortly after fitting the bar and CC just adjusted my driving style around it, maybe i was driving faster due to the HD roll bar and learnt the hard way...
still unsure of what tyres i want next, i don't mind milage but some prices are silly well, its relevant to the use i guess mind!

nice looking bar! what shocks are they?

Oversteer in the dry with a camber compensator,? Very Unusual, These promote understeer in cornering, but there are so many other variables in chassis set up, you may have toe out on the rear, un suitable tyre pressures or unbalanced corner weights. Sounds like a good set up session is required, the wet reveals the weakest link on any vehicle, the steering grip factor, an over steering car soon turns into an under steerer in the rain, exaggerated even more for examples sake on snow or ice, were it can just mean no direction change at all, a stiff and bared up car is all but useless.
I quick little tale as it's BGP Silverstone w/end, I was on my way to the circuit VERY Early one morning in a well known performance 4wd car, driving quick when I could, within the law and speed limits when it was prudent, and WELL reserved down the narrow lanes, it's Harvest time, yes TRACTORS suddenly pulling out of fields,,, Now I have a Porsche behind, close and being stupid and lamp flashing, soon as it's down to A 50 limit , he floors it at about 80!! No worries to me, he's gone, 1/2 hour later it's hissing down, the Porsche came to me suddenly, all the bravado gone, I can see now it's all barred up and low, rock solid suspension too, it's all over the place in the rain. My turn to go!! I never saw him again, the moral is not to bias a road car to much too all out track type suspension, just enjoy a good up grade with the best all round tyres you can run too. Regards BBB.

Nah just wet, i meant it wasn't the holy grail when it took me by surprise on a wet road lol
tbh i've never had the alinement checked! must get that one on the list when i get the bug back, what do i ask the spotty tyre fitter to set it to?

your deffo on to something there, especially in Cornwall where the roads are bumpy and or muddy in a fair few places! think the koni shocks would be best? (reds) over my gpr2's? they seem kinda harsh.
cheers

[buildabiggerboxer]

you need a good air cooled w/shop to toe it front and rear, Matt Keene is in Cornwall, dont even think about quickfit or the like. rear is good at 15` toe in, front 30`toe in, or a bit less than 1/8" in old money, same values work for swing axle or IRS.

[andy198712]

you need a good air cooled w/shop to toe it front and rear, Matt Keene is in Cornwall, dont even think about quickfit or the like. rear is good at 15` toe in, front 30`toe in, or a bit less than 1/8" in old money, same values work for swing axle or IRS.

he is yes, i'll have to track down his new workshop.

is that a good setting for street? what kind of characteristics will that give, or rather should that give?

Cheers!