Type IV (2316) Turbo Motor... input please...

coachreed · Post by **coachreed** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 4:58 am

I was planning my motor for my project (Hannah) and wanted to find out some info. I know I am going with a Type IV and will be using the 911 fan and everything and am pretty sure at this point that I will be going with 2316 cc's. I spent some time talking to Jake Raby last night about this and by the time I got off the phone, he pretty much had me going with a normally aspirated motor. Does anyone have any experience with this type of motor? I am new to turbo's (my first ownership experience with turbo is my newly acquired '92 Typhoon... just since December) and have never worked on a VW motor. I plan to have Jake do the work, but just needed ideas. What compression ratio would I need to run (keeping in mind that I will have the better cooling of the 911 fan)? What kind of fuel delivery should I use (efi or carb)? What size of turbo would work best? I know that there are a lot of variables so I am looking for help. Jake said that at this point, nobody has a turbo kit for the application I am going for so I will be running into a lot of extra expense.

Well, now that I have rambled so long, I will let you answer. Thanks in advance.

Coach

Steve Arndt · Post by **Steve Arndt** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 8:36 am

A few ideas.

You'll need to have an exhaust system modified to work with the turbo. It must position the turbo high enough so that the gravity oil drain works unrestricted. The turbo must be isolated from the engine compartment otherwise it will run too hot to be a real street car. For cost savings, less hassles, and space saving build an intake manifold setup that ties into a single throttle body which you hook the turbo up to. Single throttle bodies can be had for 20 bucks from a junk yard with a throttle position sensor. You'll need programmable EFI to do a proper conversion with daily driver convenience and reliability. Carbs are just too much of a bandaid fix, a compromise at EVERY range of engine speed, load, and ambient conditions. EFI can be tailored to meet exactly the needs of the engine. Go for a fuel and ignition computer, because you'll need boost retard anyway.

Instead of really dropping the compression back and promoting a sloggy bottom end when off bost, you should leave the compression around 8:1 and limit boost to about 6 PSI. Don't go wild on the cam. If you build a nice mild natural aspirated configuration, then add light boost to it you'll have the best setup for the street.

Check out the supercharger kit that Jake is going to be installing. Buy one so I can see how they work on the street!

Steve

[This message has been edited by Steve Arndt (edited 03-13-2001).]

coachreed · Post by **coachreed** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 9:19 am

Steve-

Thanks for the reply. You pretty much nailed what I was thinking this morning while working out (do my best thinking there). I was thinking from what I have read (Maximum Boost) and what I have heard that I would go for a nice mild NA motor 7.5-8:1 CR with a NA cam. Next, I have done a lot of reading in the past about VNT or VGT turbo's. With the lower boost that I am going for (5-7 psi) and the the fact that they will recover quicker from manual shifts, this seems to be a great application for this. I also intend to incorporate a water-air intercooler as well.

One thing I am unsure of now from what I have read about VNT or VGT turbo's is the boost control. Do they have internal or external waste gates? I guess I should plan to install an external waste gate with an electronic boost controller anyway, but these are things I need to learn more about. I guess it is time to go read Maximum Boost... AGAIN! (<---third to fourth time)

Anyway, any more info would be great. Such as who makes a good programable FI? Do these systems have their own ignition systems? Distributorless? Again... need more info!

Randy

coachreed · Post by **coachreed** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 9:23 am

Oh, one more thing I was brainstorming about. What about cooling the turbo (water cooler center as oposed to not)? If I have a cooling system for the water-air intercooler, can I also use this for helping to cool the center section, or should I plan to have another cooler for this? Is this overkill? Even though this will be a toy, I would like to get as much protection from the heat... especially being in FL with the heat and humidity.

Thanks again.

Coach

Steve Arndt · Post by **Steve Arndt** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 12:18 pm

You don't need water flowing all the time in your water to air intercooler, only when it warms up. You would need to set your turbo's water pump up for this duty cycle.

Water cooled turbos seem to last a lot longer. From what I've read anyway this seems true.

You do not need an electronic boost control. They are a waste of money. You can do all the boost control you need with affordable pneumatics and a conventional wastegate.
Go to www.autospeed.com then to the online store, buy Julian Edgar's book "21st Century Performance". It is one of the only honest performance handbooks for modern automobile tuning that is around. He tells it like it is for the most part. How to test things and analyze, so as to not needlessly replace good components. The book is expensive, but if you are seriously considering EFI and turbos, the books is required!!!!!!! Also buy his turbo and supercharger book. I don't have it yet, but I'm going to buy it soon. I'll say it again, buy the book.

coachreed · Post by **coachreed** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 1:50 pm

Steve-

Thanks for the recommended reading material. I will go out and buy both books ASAP. I need to get things rolling now, or Jake will be too busy to get me in. I need to strip down my core motor and send it his way so he can work me in. Anyway, thanks for everything.

Coach

Steve Arndt · Post by **Steve Arndt** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 2:09 pm

I understand trying to stay on top of these pesky and oh so busy shops

I'm bending Oliver Knuf's ear daily! It won't be long until Idaho's first 2.6 liter thumpin kick butt Typ Vier is mopping the streets. Arg!