Offroading and oil pressure issues

Class 11 streeter · Post by **Class 11 streeter** » Mon Jan 20, 2003 3:04 am

Hey all

As everyone knows, the Type I in unmodified form has a serious problem when offroading (or high G cornering for that matter) of loosing it's oil supply at the pickup. Makes sense it has this problem when we are using it for things it wasn't intended for like racing or offroading.

When my sedan is in a nose up or nose down attitude going up or down steep hills, the oil light is on or flickering constantly. Installing a tuna can requires splitting the case to replace the stock short oil pickup retaining stud, something not easily done with the engine in the bug.

On the Type V, without a sump plate allowing a tuna can, what options are avaliable to keep the oil flowing?

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I am from the Government, and I am here to help!

Type 5 Joe · Post by **Type 5 Joe** » Mon Jan 20, 2003 8:39 am

I run Dry-sump on my Sandrail, it's worth every $$$ and the time /custom parts to do it right.

Maybe an oil accumilator? (spelling)

- Joe

Badbugtwo · Post by **Badbugtwo** » Mon Jan 20, 2003 7:19 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Class 11 streeter:
On the Type V, without a sump plate allowing a tuna can, what options are avaliable to keep the oil flowing?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually the bottom of the case can be modified to accept a sump.

Here's a shot of my case with an enlarged Autocraft sump installed. The engine now holds 8.5 quarts of oil and I run it only up to the add line on the dipstick.

I chose the Autocraft sump because it attaches to only one side of the case, but it was a little work to revamp the pickup tube.

Here’s another picture of a case that Rocky modified to accept a 4-quart Berg sump that was also modified to a different gasket pattern.

If you have your case modified, make sure the place that welds it takes their time so as not to warp the case!

Lastly, I agree with Joe that in your application, a dry sump may be the best solution.

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Jeff Rogers
www.badbug.com

mudman · Post by **mudman** » Tue Jan 21, 2003 8:54 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Type 5 Joe:
 I run Dry-sump on my Sandrail, it's worth every $$$ and the time /custom parts to do it right.

Maybe an oil accumilator? (spelling)

- Joe<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Joe, just wondering what kind of money was spent on the drysump setup, and if it was a piece together, or was it a whole unit from one company. I do a little about them, I was helping a guy that ran the winsten west tour car's years ago and he was running a drysump.
Also helped out a VW drag racer here in Vancouver that had a drysump on his dragster.

Type 5 Joe · Post by **Type 5 Joe** » Wed Jan 22, 2003 5:56 am

I have used the C. B. Performance pump make by Schadek with good success.

I think the price is around $100.00

The tank is about $150.00 *I think*

I blueprinted the pump, to allow it to sit in further (line up the oil holes)

Port-matched the inlet, plugged the outlet (inside the 2nd stage of the pump body)

Tapped the outside of the pressure cavity for a AN fitting, route this thru a filter, and back into the full-flow fitting (main oil galley)

I use field-service fittings, and steel braided lines (w/ black cloth coating) available at your local Catapillar Dealer. I think they are #8, the same I.D. as the oil passages in a late Type I case.

These lines are designed to be changed in length, when your configuration changes.
Alot less $$$ then buying new "crimp-on" style everytime you change your mind.

You must run a line that is twice - 3 X the volume, from the Tank to Pump inlet (feed), or you'll get low oil pressure readings...

The pulley was modified to set it back about .350", use a long bus generator, and "flat tin" against the fan shroud...

This allows me to use a stock dia pulley, and barely clears the pump.

I also welded some "bungs" in the tank, one at the bottom (side), one at the top (side) and two on the very top.

The two extra side ones, are for some brass fittings, elbow"s" and Polyethelene tubing for a "sight" guage. I can see my oil level from the drivers seat in my rail...

The top ones connect to an oil seperator / breather that seperates the "slosh" and air, allowes the oil to drain back to the motor.
The valve covers also vent to this...

You also need a quality shut-off valve under the tank, or the system will "bleed" after a few days, and fill the crancase with oil.

You can enjoy more H.P.(positive piston displacement) less windage, continuous oil feed to the bearings, 10 quart capacity, alot of strange looks, and questions....

- Joe

[This message has been edited by Type 5 Joe (edited 01-22-2003).]

mudman · Post by **mudman** » Wed Jan 22, 2003 12:35 pm

The pulley was modified to set it back about .350", use a long bus generator, and "flat tin" against the fan shroud...

This allows me to use a stock dia pulley, and barely clears the pump.

Thanks Joe, that IS the main part I was wondering about. I need all of the cfm out of the fan I can get with my race car. I am using the blue areoquip powersteering hose for my oel system, seem's like I have about 10 mile's of the stuff.

mudman · Post by **mudman** » Wed Jan 22, 2003 12:42 pm

Sorry another question, Is that a 2 or a 3 stage pump? Also are you running an extra cooler?
I have fitted up a T-4 cooler and have a big 10X10 oil cooler mounted inside the car. So far so good.

Post by **Marc** » Wed Jan 22, 2003 1:52 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Class 11 streeter:
As everyone knows, the Type I ... Installing a tuna can requires splitting the case to replace the stock short oil pickup retaining stud,
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Huh? I've replaced that stud many times on an assembled engine. You need to heat/bend/grind a 10mm wrench to the correct shape to get to the pickup holddown nut, and it's not much fun doing it while the oil is still dripping in your face, but it can be done.

Type 5 Joe · Post by **Type 5 Joe** » Wed Jan 22, 2003 2:57 pm

Two-stage pump, Doghouse, no extra cooler.

If you did install one more cooler, the most effective place would be, between the scavenge and tank return line...

- Also, a correctly engineered oil separater (spelling bee) to control the slosh, and return the oil to the crankcase, and vent the system. This is the biggy for off-road.

Nobody makes one that is worth a darn.
(insert four letter cus word)

I can explain how I did mine...

- Joe

Class 11 streeter · Post by **Class 11 streeter** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 2:41 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Marc:
Huh? I've replaced that stud many times on an assembled engine...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

C'mon down and bring your special tool to fix my engine, there's a cold brew and a warm hug in it for you.