How do I identify exactly what engine I have -'72 Beetle

[rrb6699]

in case I want to rebuild it so I make sure I get all the right parts.

[aussiebug]

Here's the engine numbers for 1972.
Engine D 0,835,007 - D 1,000,000 34bhp(DIN) 1200
Engine AC 0,003,240 - AC 0,006,700 40bhp(DIN)1300
Engine AB 0,350,001 - AB 0,699,001 44bhp(DIN)1300
Engine AF 0,000,445 - AF 0,000,801 46bhp(DIN)1600
Engine AE 0,558,001 - AE 0,917,263 47bhpDIN 60bhpSAE 1600(USA)
Engine AD 0,360,023 - AD 0,598,001 50bhpDIN 65bhpSAE 1600
Engine AH 0,000,001 - AH 0,005,900 47 bhp(DIN)1600(USA)

Look at your engine number (under the oil filler tower) and hopefully it will be on that list (if ti's the original engine).

If the letter prefix fits, that's the type of engine it was when that engine was built. Trouble is, it's VERY easy to alter bug engines, so your's might not be stock/standard now, even if you are lucky enough to have the original engine.

Other things can help identify your engine too - the carb/distributor being used. Generator or Alternator. Single port or twin port design. Doghouse fan shroud or earlier non-doghouse shroud.

A few pics of the engine (general pic and some closeup stuff) and we could narrow it down for you.

[rrb6699]

it must not be original. the numbers in the location you describe are: 126-060281
there are numbers on the intake or headers too:
vw-113 129 710D
15 515 K68


it has a generator and fan shroud.

ive put electronic ignition and 2bbl Weber Carb on it.
I also put an 8-pass oil cooler with filter on it.

I cant upload because my Assdroid phone cant handle it now for some reason. I can email or refer you to a post I made wit engine pics the last post under this topic shows my engine:

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 5&start=15

[aussiebug]

The 126 engine number would indicate that it started life as a 1600 industrial engine - VW made thousands of them for compressors, generators etc.

Nothing wrong with that - the engine is essentially the same as the car engine, but usually came with a throttle control for steady rpm and usually either a 009 distributor (similar to what it has now) or a magneto ignition so it did not need a battery (hand crank starts).

It's very similar to a 71 or 72 1600 twin port engine.

The 9 digit VW number is a part number for that component.

The pic in that link shows that the fuel filter is in a poor place. It should always be before the fuel pump, not after it. That gives the fuel pump nice clean fuel to work with, and it also stops any chance of the weight of the filter loosening the inlet in the top of the carb. I have not heard of it happening with the Weber carbs, but it's certainly a REAL problem for the Solex carbs - a few toasted bugs have resulted from that problem.

[rrb6699]

so many questions now. thanks for the info!
so how did this engine get in this bug? was it a factory decision? this is not a 1600 dual port then?

are there differences between industrial engines vs standard bug engines? this engine is really running smooth now. it really runs very smooth at certain rpm ranges. like about 45-50 mph in 3rd gear. also, I have started this in 1st gear no problem. when I had the clutch cable break once quite a ways from home I had to drive it by starting it in 1st gear and at stop signs turn it off and do the same thing. I got really good at shifting without the clutch too but had to figure out how to do it.

I will change fuel filter location once I double check that.

so you said the last part of that number is p/n for the throttle control? id like to try and hand crank it to start. how would I test that?

how can I get more info on this engine?

sorry for so many questions.

[Max Welton]

This would not have been installed by VW. After this many years few cars still have their original engines. Someone put that in because that is what they had on hand.

Max

[SCOTTRODS]

Pull start VW - -- -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PI46qVW2WA4

[BayouBoy63]

I'm new to the buggy life and purchased a road ready restore but the PO could not tell me exactly what engine it is other than a 1600.

Going by the numbers I'm sure the engine is from a '68, '69 or '70 bus but would like to pinpoint if possible.
B5 15 3814, it has a similar intake number 113 129 701K

Thanks for any help

[Marc]

BayouBoy63,
That number dates indicates an early Baywindow Bus engine, but as has been pointed out its configuration may have changed over the years. The original dished pistons may have been replaced with flat-tops (raises the compression ratio by ~0.2 if nothing else is changed). According to Bentley, flat-tops were factory installed through B5039389; when they dropped the C.R., presumably to increase engine life expectancy, the HP rating wasn't changed - they continued to advertise it as 57 SAE/47 DIN.

`68 & `69 were "single-relief" cases; for the `70 model year they enlarged the oil passages and went to a dual relief valve system, essentially the same as was used in the `71-up 1600 engines with dualport heads. According to the chart at theSamba, this should be a dual-relief case produced in the first half of 1970.

If it's a single-relief case (not a replacement one that had those numbers stamped in) it's comparable to the `68/`69 Beetle H5 1500 cases, and not likely to be in great condition. These "cottage cheese" cases were infamous for pulled head studs, cracks, and warping even in a sedan, so few which have been doing duty in a Bus all these years are worth using for a rebuild...

The improved oiling system of the dual-relief cases helped their longevity substantially, but the case alloy didn't really get addressed properly until 1971 ("AE" case dualport).

In the rather unlikely event that yours is a good'un, be nice to it and make sure it's never overheated but DO NOT hot-rod it or use it for the foundation of a quality rebuild.

My memory's foggy on intake manifold numbers - doesn't help that VW obsoleted some in the early `70s to simplify dealer inventory, and that various models have been sold in the aftermarket over the years as "universal" replacement parts. Does yours have a small vacuum nipple under the carb flange on the right side, midway down the inlet tube, or one on the runner over the left head?
If I remember correctly, the 701K was used in several applications including 1970 Bug, so I wouldn't be surprised to find it on a 1970 Bus also, even though the original part was more likely to be the 701AA.

[rrb6699]

ill look. the engine runs beautifully. I put a Weber 32/36 DFAV carb on it to replace the solex. this has its own intake adapter. I have pics on the site here somewhere in my posts. it seems more like one of the Industrial engines rebuilt with a different cam. sounds like a little muscle car idling. it did take some time to get it tweaked right. as it is now, a 1/16 turn will change the idle characteristics. theres another adjustment screw on the rear top left of the carb that seems to have minimal affect on how it runs. I have had it all the way in and out but did not notice idle change. maybe its high idle?

anyway, ive added an 8-pass oil cooler and oil filter that came with it. ive changed it to K &N last oil change. I have an electric fuel pump (Carter 4psi) at the ready should I need it. currently, im getting a solid 30mpg+ highw
ay driving and 20-22+mpg in horrid stop and go where there's a lot of 1st & 2nd gear only
shifting.

I just replaced the starter from the true 43 y.o. original that was on it. but today after several weeks of starting, the same no start symptom started again that caused me to replace the original. turn the key and a click but no start. then all the sudden you turn the key and it starts. I will look under it tomorrow to se if a wire is loose. seems like that symptom matches the intermittent starts.

but, I think I got a good engine. I adjusted the valves by matching the rotor position to #1 firing to begin gapping. I hope thats right. I did gain some power.

ok, I'll wait for comments.

[Marc]

rrb6699,
My last comments were directed at BayouBoy63, not you - sorry that I didn't make that clear until now.

The 32/36 progressive carb's not real popular for street use in this neck of the woods. They're subject to hesitation on acceleration unless jetted pig-rich, and cool/damp weather exacerbates it...not really the carburetor that's the cause, more the lack of adequate manifold heat (even with the $$$ manifolds with a better heat-riser design, aftermarket exhaust systems don't provide much flow for them to work with). In your climate you should have a much better chance of success, but as you've discovered they can be very sensitive. If you're getting 30MPG without an annoying flat spot, you're doing better than average in the Northwest

Not a big fan of external coolers, especially those with a filter plumbed in series with them. 40 years ago everyone thought these were the way to go, but the stock "doghouse" system that the factory put on dualport engines has proven to be the better choice...if you must have a filter, it should be one of the several setups which take oil off at the pump, filter it, and return it to the "hot" side of the system. What sort of fan housing does your engine have? For starters, is it OEM or aftermarket, and does it have a cavity on the firewall side where the cooler's supposed to reside, or was its cooler inside the shroud? Some pictures, even if just of the old oil cooler, would help here.

Besides poor cable connections, a likely suspect for a no-crank problem is a faulty ignition switch. The "modular" type that debuted for the `72 model year (and the similar modular one found in later cars) seems to be more prone to this than the earlier designs...the good news is that they're easier to change than the `68-`70 and `71 style are. You can even unplug the harness from the installed switch, plug in a new one and operate it with a screwdriver to confirm the diagnosis before you start tearing the wheel off to iinstall it - don't forget you still need to use the key to unlock the steering before you drive off 1972 thru mid`74 take the 111 905 865K switch.

Under the back seat cushion you should find an inline connector in the fat (4.0mm, ~10 Gauge) red wire that heads to the solenoid from there. If a jumper wire from the battery positive post to that junction makes the starter work when the ignition switch does not, it's nearly certain that the starter/solenoid, battery, and cables are NOT the problem. I say nearly because there's always the possibility of more than one fault, and it's conceivable that the increase in current provided by the jumper wire is sufficient to overcome another "borderline" condition...but generally this is a pretty good place to start your diagnosis.

I'm unaware of any intake manifold number ending in 710_ ..."701" is VW's designation for this part, but given the original industrial application perhaps there's a series I'm unaware of (maybe with a shorter inlet pipe to allow room for a governor?).
...because if the number on your original manifold is indeed 113 129 701D, things get very perplexing - that's one of the intake manifolds found on certain 1200cc 40HP engines

[rrb6699]

im sure I wont be driving up north with it.

thanks for all that info. I put the cooler in in addition to the stock cooler.

I was under the bug today and just torqued all the generatir, starter and made sure good contact on the coil connectors. its started 4x so far when I was getting a click the 3x before I did this. ignition switch is newish-maybe a couple years old. hope it lasts longer but got it from MAmotirworks so not sure but I look to order as best quality as I can find when ordering electrical.

so far so good on the valve adjustments.

rr

[BayouBoy63]

Thanks Marc,

It's not gunna be a quality build beetle, just a weekend and parade buggy (local stuff).

I was just wanting to know exactly (or real close to) what I have to keep her running should problems arise.
She runs great now, no issues to speak of except a lil to much positive camber on the rear but that's a whole other subject.

buggy.jpg

[rrb6699]

nice!

[ALYKAT III]

I'd drive that ! A lot !