Floor pan interchange

[theKbStockpiler]

Hi , could someone please inform me of the differences in floor pans from year to year in the IRS era and why supers have there own dedicated pan as well? I notice the seat mounts look different , the jack support and maybe how much the floor is sunk for extra head room but it would be great to know the specifics. I'm thinking of installing floor pans in a 71 super and swapping seats in that have the adjustment rails built in to the seat and not the floor.

Thanks in advance!

[Buggin_74]

Are you talking about just the floorpan halves or the entire chassis?

There is no difference between Super and standard floor pan halves of the equivalent year.

The seat rails changing is the main thing, the swap to 3 point runners happened for the start of the 73 model run.

[Marc]

When the accelerator pedal pivot was moved from the pan to the cluster casting (mid`66) the contour of the pan in the pedal-stop area was changed slightly. Starting in `69 a retaining leaf spring was added to keep the seats from unintentionally sliding off the front, which involved a minor redesign to the seats and the tracks. But since all seat tracks are the same width through 1970, these subtleties are overlooked by the parts-sellers and only one floorboard is offered for all years through `70.
`71 and `72 have similar seat tracks, but they're beefed up a bit and wider; plastic strips were added to make the seats glide nicer, when these inevitably crumble the seats start flopping from side to side. Again, most parts-sellers will try to foist the earlier floorboard panels off on you; the ethical ones will mention that you need to transplant the tracks from your old floorboards or fit earlier seats.
I have Scat Pro-Car seats in several of my cars, they have the adjusting mechanism in the bottom of the seat and bolt to proprietary brackets. Scat makes several models of bracket which bolt up to the stock rails of all years of car. In my opinion their brackets are too tall (particularly the pre`73 variety) unless you're running a thin racey seat; with a comfy bucket like their ProCar 90, you sit a few inches too high in the car - the visibility's nice up there, but having the steering wheel digging into your thighs, not so much. So, if you get the Scat brackets be prepared to modify them unless you're planning to run thin seats.

[theKbStockpiler]

I finally looked at a classic beetle and I forgot how freakin small they are. I could not really believe I drove one for 2 years in my teens. The seats in this 71 are lower than I thought my 74 supers were. You are really tucked in the little sucker.


I don't plan on using the original seats and will be installing some steel to protect from a side impact that will be welded in under the front seats so there is no point in paying extra to ship a full half floor pan because of a seam.
Is anyone aware of floor pans in quarter sections that are 18 gage?

[Marc]

So far as I know the thickest on the market is the Dansk, at ~.035" (20GA) - they come as halves in red primer; I don't know if they make quarters but I haven't seen any offered for sale.
I've heard nothing but bad about the Klokkerholm (also Danish, but ~22GA) brand.
Zito (Brazilian) is also thin but at least it fits better than Klokkerholm.
Dansk `46-`70 comes with original-style jackport, while their `71/`72 (with the wider tracks you won't need, and costlier) comes with a modernized bracket designed to work with a scissors jack.

[theKbStockpiler]

Here are 2 links I found that advertise 18 gage in full half pans

http://www.mamotorworkstv.com/vw/produc ... k-support/

and http://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/Detai ... 112701062N

If I have to pay shipping on a half pan for 18 gage i'll do it.
Thanks for the insight with the seat tracks and jack points marc! Are 70-75 ish pans all the same besides for jack points and seat rails? As I was seeing if I could live with a flat windshield super ; getting in and out of it etcetera , I noticed that it was not the size of the car that made it uncomfortable, it was the lousy seat! The bottom part is too shallow or something.

[Marc]

As I said above, pre`71 is one style, `71/`72 is another, and `73-up is another still - but it's only the seat tracks (and the jack ports on some reproductions) which differentiate them, they're all the same basic shape & size so will fit in each others' place.
The cars (Standards & Supers) are all the same size from the A-pillar back, the only reason a 1303 (`73-up) Super seems any bigger is that there's more room from your knuckles to the windshield. It's been decades since I've seen a `73-up seat that wasn't hopelessly broken down (other than the limited-edition "sports" seats, anyway) but it's easier to graft in some other seats than it is to try to make the early Super suspension function as it should, it was a fatally flawed design...it only took a couple of years for the number of disgruntled customers to reach the point where VW rushed to redesign it - the new, improved second-generation design had improved geometry - specifically, negative scrub radius - which made it less prone (but not invulnerable) to the "Super Beetle Shakes". It was introduced midway through the `73 model year (the problems with the early design were too serious to wait for a regular model-year change) at VIN 1333003656, so not all big-window `73 Supers have it.

[theKbStockpiler]

I preferred a 74 super but I found a 71 in VGC in which the sale has been pending for over two weeks because they lost the title. The pick-ins are slim in the rust belt for a restorable beetle. I may have to swap the newer front end in I guess if I can't remedy any shaking issues. Marc, would you know if the super's tierods are spring loaded or not? I wonder if that could make it more/less prone to shaking? I have spring loaded tierods in a jeep and I don't really understand the positive aspects of them unless you want a sloppy steering wheel at higher speeds and even more so in high winds. That's my experience anyways.

[Marc]

No on the springloaded tierods. The steering box and idler arm are both mounted to body sheetmetal rather than the chassis, not the best arrangement (especially if the body structure is at all compromised by corrosion or accident damage). The biggest issue with the early Super front end design is the positive scrub radius, which exacerbates the other frailties in the suspension & steering. Renew all of the bushings (there are aftermarket urethane -and even brass- parts available which are stiffer than stock), ensure that the rims have as close to zero runout as possible and fit quality tires. Cheap radials tend to have skewed belts which cause them to wiggle-track. Of course the tires must also be true & balanced. Do not run any wider rims (or rims with more offset) on the front as that aggravates the scrub radius problem. `71/early`72 came with 4" ET40 rims, in mid`72 they went to 4½" ET34, which only made things worse - 4½" ET41 (III, `Ghia or `74-`79 Bug) are a better choice IF there's sufficient sidewall clearance to the coil springs - that depends upon the tire used.

Google Super Beetle Shakes, Super Beetle Shimmy/Shimmies