74 412 Manual Transmission..how rare?

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Wed Jan 01, 2003 3:12 pm

Today got a call from a local guy giving me his 1974 412 with manual transmission to me. It has not ran in 15 years, but garaged the whole time. So, I will tow it to the house tomorrow. Aren't the manual transmission cars hard to find?

alsehendo · Post by **alsehendo** » Wed Jan 01, 2003 8:47 pm

More popular than automatics.

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 5:16 am

In the US? I thought all the US cars had automatics.............

Post by **Marc** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:03 am

In fifteen years (late `70s thru early `90s) I saw ONE 4-speed Type IV come through our shop doors against dozens and dozens of automatics; it was a US-delivered car. Trans is quite different than other models (hydraulic clutch, totally different internal layout) and as I recall 4th gear was 1:1 ...acceleration is striking compared to the auto car's.

alsehendo · Post by **alsehendo** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 11:26 pm

I new they were diff and had 1 to 1 in 4th but I saw only couple, besides mine, and they were sticks and both were fastbacks. I would take the shop owners word for it he probably knows best. While we are on the subject is the auto trany diffrent from the bus?

VW Adam · Post by **VW Adam** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 11:54 pm

I thought that all of the Wagons and 4 doors were automatics and the 2 doors came with 4 speed manuals in the US. Am I right? I don't have a Type 4 but if I found a 2door 4speed I would.

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 4:46 am

i would say yes..........it is different....I had one out of a 411 I parted out a few weeks back and it was odd looking for sure.......Its mounting points for sure are quite different

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 12:47 pm

The only Type 4 with a manual transmission available in the US, was the 1974 412 two-door. The only other Type 4s in the US with a manual transmission were conversions and grey market models.

The transmission itself is very similar to the transmission in a Transporter with a Type 4 engine.

-René

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:58 pm

The tranny is very different..........has like an automatic drain pan on it, and the wierdest slave cylinder you will ever see! I think the gearing is more close ratio, too, or so i have heard.

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 1:11 pm

Yes...I drive these. They are very quick transaxles...and very light...about half the weight of an 091. They have a 1:1 4th. They do not actually have a fourth gear. They have a coupling linking the main and counter shafts together in high gear. The final drive ratios are excellent. The 2 doors mostly used 3.79:1. The wagons used 3.91:1. They are very smooth ...and very easy to work on. No jigs...only a few special wrenches. They have a 3 piece case. Tailcone, gearsection...with the access lid to the syncros and counter shaft...and the differential section. It is actually quite a sophisticated design. Similarities to Audi is huge. Short of a few bearings...there is not a single part common with any other VW transaxle ever built. Except for the differential gear set..which is the same style and make as the gears in the type 3 and 4 auto boxes....but the differential spool is a different casting. These transmisions will run forever...but all have a couple of inherent flaws that will literally destroy ALL of these when they reach high milage. These flaws are actually quite simple to fix. They include replacing the needle bearings on the countershaft with new ones that have an outer shell...replacing the counter shaft as well (its a simple 18mm shaft with a step cut on it) and replacing differential bearings BEFORE you get wear on the spider pinions...as they are unique and cannot be sourced. I also have a method of dropping in a type 3 or 4 auto box differential...which has much better pinions...and is bulletproof...but it requires machining new bearing spacers for the side bearings (not too hard or expensive)...and extensive tedious set-up adjustments to the differential. Not all that hard...but not for the faint of heart. PLEASE do not throw these transaxles away when you find them. I am not rich, but could at least give you something for them if possible. They only shipped a few thousnad of them. If they are in good shape...and have not contracted differential of counter gear "cancer" yet...they can be repaired and made perfectly drivable for under $200 bucks. Its rare that anything other than that listed above...wears out. Ray

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 5:00 pm

Thanks for the info Ray!! Good to hear from you I am diving into my 412 pretty hard core now!

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 12:30 pm

By the way, Oasis....The 4 speeds came in all years to this continent. I have found them in models from 70 through 74...and yes, only in 2 doors. Some gray market wagons and four doors may have slipped through with 4 speeds...but few. Most are conversions. All of the mounting points and linkage and clutch slave holes are already installed in all type 4's on the assembly line. With help from a friend...and all of the parts...you can convert from auto to manual...no drilling or cutting , in about 4 hours. The space and hole for the fluid tube is already in the body and is capped with a rubber plug at the end of the tunnel and covered with undercoating. Look for it...its there. The bracket that holds the front shift rod support bushing is already welded into the body. If you remove the auto shifter, you will find a wide square hole with a couple of extra mounting holes on either side. This is where the shifter and gate drop in. The rear support for the shift rod is a simple boot/disk that snaps onto a locating tang at the back of the tunnel, in place of the one with hole in the center where the auto shift cable exits. Behind the brake master resoivoir in the trunk, you will find a pre-drilled extra hole for the 3 spigot resovoir, that feeds the clutch master. Lastly, the pre-drilled and tapped holes onthe left hand side of the frame member that holds the master cylinder under the dash...are for the slave cylinder. Under the carpet, next to the tunnel on the pass. side you will find several spot welded metal hold down tabes for the clutch pressure line as well as a hole where it enters under the back seat and into the tunnel....all of this...on all type 4's! Very forward thinking of them! Ray

Davidf · Post by **Davidf** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:35 pm

Hi, maybe i am a lucky guy, but the 412 1973 wagon that i am restoring and the other one bought for parts (412 1973 wagon), both one have 4 speed tranny.Ray you talk about hight millage, mine have near 80000 miles and wend i change the oil in it, it was looking like old oil, no metal or water in it.It's shift good,no noise from it, should i look in it for someting or let it go on the road again?
It's my dayly driver for summer time.

David

------------------
David
412 wagon 1973

Bulley · Post by **Bulley** » Fri Jan 24, 2003 3:53 pm

Has anyone inverted a 914 5-speed tranny, or used a 911 tranny in their 412?

I have this thought that a 5-speed overdrive matched to a 2056 hydraulic would be a really nice driver.

gmb

Vgonman · Post by **Vgonman** » Sun Jan 26, 2003 5:41 pm

I have a good friend that was a vw tech at the dealership from about 1970 to about 1985............he swears the 412's with the manual speed were rockets! He states that only a few of them ever made it to the dealership, and he thought they were awesome and quite peppy for an aircooled VW........

I think you would have trouble keeping the oil temps down with a 2056 considering the oddities of the intakes..........seems like the wrong car for a big type 4