Devastator's upgrade

[Ol'fogasaurus]

For esthetic only reasons;, fill it in; its just a few additional ounces of metal held in place by four pounds of weld (based on my welding practices/skills). Just remember, it is un-sprung weight.

Lee

[73AZ]

May I suggest rethinking the need to reach between the gussets with the stick welder?

If the shock mount plate is welded to the frame tube prior to installing the gussets you would have good access for a mig gun.
You can use the shock mounting hole to restrain the mount; bolt a suitable length of tubing in there and fix the tube's other end to some sort of weighty type thing that will keep it in place.
Preheat the plate.
Run a series of short beads ~1.5" and overlap your starts by ~3/16 onto the previous bead with a few minutes between beads and the plate shouldn't be pulled much at all.

After welding the plate to tubes you can dress the weld and fit up the gussets.

However you go about it please remember to preheat that plate and when you run a bead keep anout 2/3 of the bead on the plate. When you join two materials with such dissimular through thickness there is a danger of over penetration of the thinner material. In this case you may blow through the tube.
Preheat that plate and keep the majority of the weld on the plate and it'll tie into the tube just fine.

Hope that helps

[73AZ]

Oh yeah, I also vote to fill it

[73AZ]

Well crap

I just went back and re-read what you wrote and see that you want to reach the inside of the gussets themselves.

It is completely unnecessary, in my opinion, to weld the inside of the gusset to plate joint.
Bevel the gussets a touch and you will have great root access for a single fillet on the outside of the joint. Welding the backside of the joint is un-needed hassle and headache.

[73AZ]

You don't like your arc welds?

What rod are you useing? Have you tried a drag rod like 7018? A drag rod makes
for welds that are much better looking than MIG welds, in my humble opinion anyway...

[Devastator]

I'm going to bevel the 2 upright gussets before welding them. I was referring to the weld between the gusset, (1/4 in. material BTW), to the 1-1/2" x .095 wall tubing. Sure, I like my arc welds and have never had one fail. I'll be using 3/32 dia. 6011, however, which is well known for leaving an ugly, yet very strong, weld, regardless of preheating and/or bevels. 6011 is not a great vertical rod either, which only adds to the ugliness of the impending weld. I think the only 7018 rod I have is 1/8" dia., which is pretty big for what I'm welding, (to).

A drag rod makes
for welds that are much better looking than MIG welds, in my humble opinion anyway...

I never underestimate my ability to make ANY form of welding uglier than possible.

[73AZ]

Yeah, 1/8 7018 is too large for this joint.

I guess I had it right the first time then maybe I need to pick up a reading comp. class next samester

I really think welding the horozontal plate to the tube and then bringing in the gussets will give you the best joint here, but you know what they say about opinions.

1/4 is over kill with your mount design and you could easily use lighter material. Some 3/16 would still be in the range of over kill but would weld out easier, and with your rod of choice and angle to reach in there I would really worry about getting penetration into the plate without blowing through the tube.

I'd like to come take a look at that Saturn throttle body and wouldn't mind lending a hand on this, even if just to explain myself better in person.
I can bring 3/32 7018 and 3/16 plate with me if you want

[Devastator]

I should have also mentioned that the horizontal plate is 5/16 steel plate. I used this combination of plates because I had the 5/16 left over from the trailing arm end plates, and the 1/4 from the front spindles. I don't have any 3/16, or I would use it so I could get better weld penetration. However, even if I don't get great penetration on the 5/16 and 1/4 plates, I should get ample penetration on the .095 wall tubing. I'm not at all concerned about the welds, gussets, or shock mounts failing. There's a lot more metal there than needed for sure. I just don't want to invite the "why didn't you weld the inside of the gussets", or " that weld inside those gussets looks like bird poop" conversations my way. I'm already hearing about how the trailing arms should have been chromoly, the bearing housings should have been bolt in aluminum, I shouldn't have painted the trailing arms until they were done, there was no second gunman, etc.

I'd like to come take a look at that Saturn throttle body and wouldn't mind lending a hand on this, even if just to explain myself better in person.
I can bring 3/32 7018 and 3/16 plate with me if you want

Sure! I probably won't make new gussets with the 3/16 plate, but I still have the front end to do...

[73AZ]

Sounds good, I'll PM you

[Sneaks]

Yeh, then in 10 years it'll end up in my yard and you can hear me cursing about how much bondo I have to grind off...

[Devastator]

Yeh, then in 10 years it'll end up in my yard and you can hear me cursing about how much bondo I have to grind off...

So, is that a vote for not covering the opening?

[Sneaks]

I'm torn. Covering it would make it more finished looking but leaving it displays the craftsmanship.

Just no bondo.

Please.

For explanation, just look at my latest thread about the bus I'm restoring. God, I'm so SICK OF BONDO.

[Devastator]

Just no bondo.

Well, alright, if you insist.

[Qurtys Lyn]

Just no bondo.

Well, alright, if you insist.

Sneaks and I will beat you numb with a wet noodle if we find out about bondo usage...

[73AZ]

Sneaks and I will beat you numb with a wet noodle if we find out about bondo usage...

If you read that quickly it sounds just plain wrong.


What sort of place is this, anyway?