why build a T5 and not A T4

4getaboutit · Post by **4getaboutit** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:57 am

Was thinking about building a T4 for more performance. Just got done with my2.0L T4 this april. I got a 1.8L and was thinking about building some torque Hp monster. What is the benifts and pitfalls of building up a T5. The little bit I gathered that sounded great was the ability of using the T1 heads, then my hearts sank when I also found out you couldn't use the T1 crank. Is there better power from the T5 than the T4? Cheaper to build?
Not sure what the motor would be used for yet, Ghia, GL Bus, gokart

?

Thanks in advance.

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 10:01 am

4getaboutit : The watercooled to air conversion using the vanagon engine block as your base. You can use the type 1 cranks! I have built a number engines with type 1 cranks. Where did you get your information? The biggest advantage of the vanagon case is its make of aluminum, and it can support bore sizes from 85.5 through 103mm. The casting is better than most all aftermarket cases. Racers can ream bush & run .841 & .905 o.d. roller lifters in a strong aluminum block. A 86mm crank will fit into the vanagon block just as easy as a bug style case. Thanks Rocky for more info. Go to www.rockyjennings.com

4getaboutit · Post by **4getaboutit** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 9:49 pm

After reading this site is where i thought you couldn't use the T1 crank. T5 would seam to be great stronger case with being able to use the T1 aftermarket performance parts sounds great. the T4 performance parts are so expensive I don't think I'd be able to ever be able to build what I could dream and still pay my mortgage.

thanks for the info, But more input would be appreciated

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:53 am

4getaboutit. If you want more info. Please ask ? so we can answer them. Thanks Rocky

4getaboutit · Post by **4getaboutit** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:16 am

What kind of power does these T5 motors make? Whats the expected price would one have to spend to make a T5 motor? How do they bolt up to 76Bay. Thanks

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:51 am

If I had a 2.0 76 T2 I would build a t-4 engine. Use bigger P&cs like 96mm. Have my crank counterweighted & maybe a little bigger cam like a web 73. The vanagon conversion engine is better suited to going into a early T-2 67 down or in a bug or KG. or T-3 not a heavy late model bus. Just my thoughts. Its not cheap to build a oxyboxer engine, Just case mods can run up to $900.00 to 1,200.00. Thanks Rocky

4getaboutit · Post by **4getaboutit** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 6:19 pm

I see your fron onion country, do you ever run in the portland area? I'm in vancouver, WA. Thanks for your help>

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:03 pm

Yes ran at portland Aug.-1-04 , 10.40, 128mph with a vanagon h20 to air engine all motor. Sept 10 & 11 will be racing at Walla Walla at an all import race with NHRA wallys as the top award. All import cars can race we have two classes for VWs and two classes for all the other import cars. Big steak dinner for everyone on friday night the 10th at 6pm with racing afterwards. Giant car show downtown on sat the 11th. With racing at 1pm Lots of fun. go to www.bonanzaraceway.com Thanks Rocky

vrsechslvr · Post by **vrsechslvr** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 8:29 pm

pocketrocket:
From reading thru the site it appears that you are one of the rare few, experienced persons involved in the H20/O2 conversions. I have a few questions that you may be able to answer.
1. Do you have to use the Porsche cooling conversion? I've seen some euro fan set-ups using a flat/laydown design. Have you seen these?
2. If using 94mm cyl for the conversion, aren't the walls too thin for daily driver use? I was told this when building my type I. But I noticed that the bore can accomodate 103mm. Are the cyl walls still too thin?
4. I know you use one for drag use, do you have experience with one for a daily driver? Reliability?

I've had my sedan for over a year now and on the third motor. After the 1st motor(flywheel came off 2nd week after purchase) I bought a 1914cc from Quality German(wanted a little umph), but I apparently "overrevved" the motor doing 65 on the freeway(<5months). My current base 1600dp (used) has been great. I put over 500mi a week on the motor and it still runs great. But I would like more umph (hence the 1914cc).

5.Does the "Oxyboxer" provide daily performance and better reliability over the type I?

6. If it seems the logical choice to convert to a type V, why are they so rare?

Overall, I'm looking to build a strong reliable motor that will see some track time. I want the motor to be trouble free for at least five years.

Sorry it's sooooo long, but any response will be greatly appreaciated.

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:42 am

Vrsechslur: You could use a number of cooling systems we used the t-1 style , making a block to mount the oil cooler in the fan shroud for the oil lines up to it and back to the case it works just like the t-1, we also used the t-4 oil cooler . Many say the 94mm p&cs are to thin maybe so, but I have used them for years with no problems. We have not used a 101mm p&c set for a street engine as I don't know of any heads that will cool well enough. The H2o to air conversion is only a much better crankcase aluminum vs. magnesium with a oil filter mount built in on the aluminum case everything else is t-1 parts. The biggest hold up is the conversion is not cheap it costs way more to do the conversion than a new machined t-1 block would cost! Thanks Rocky

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 7:37 pm

pocketrocket,
what are the choices for exhaust, since the oxy uses T1 parts could i also use my headers and phat boy exhaust.

also how is the drivabilty for a daily driver. i know a type 4 you can cruise all day at 80 and get up to 100 no problem, what about the oxy.

thanks
dan

podboy3 · Post by **podboy3** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 7:39 pm

sorry guys,
that last post was me, forgot to log in

thanks
dan

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Sat Sep 25, 2004 9:58 am

podboy3; You can use any t-1 ex. system. As far as drivabilty it all depends on the comb. you build. Remerber the oxy is a t-1 engine with a factory aluminum case. I like the converison best for drag racing you can use 101mm to 103mm, 4" to 4.060 p&cs because of the wider head stud pattern. To run the 94mm bug style p&cs you must bring the head stud pattern in and to do it right you should use a adapter ring from the case to the cylinder. Its not easy or cheap. Rocky

vrsechslvr · Post by **vrsechslvr** » Tue Sep 28, 2004 7:13 pm

I would like to start the process of building a T5 (aka stock piling parts). What would be the best motor to start with? Is there a better Vanagon motor to start with?
I would like to run the 101mm p&c's to relieve the cost of re-studding and increase reliability. Are those hard to come by or can they be ordered?

Oh hell, when would be a good time to call?

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Tue Sep 28, 2004 8:43 pm

Vrsechslvr: Shop hours 8:30 to 12:00am 1:00 to 6:00 pm pacific time. Rocky