Valvetrain Geometry

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 4:36 pm

So you can't use an adjustable pushrod with double HD springs....so its recommended to get light duty springs(which you can get anywhere, right?) just for checking the valvetrain geometry. To switch out springs, you need a valve spring compression tool(bench). Then when you're ready to start up your engine for the first time and break in your cam, you need to remove the inner(the inner spring is the harder one, right?) Then to put the inner spring back in, you have to use a valve spring compression tool(in-car version).

Those tools are f'in expensive! Is there an easy way around all this bs?

Thanks,
Andy

A_67vdub · Post by **A_67vdub** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 4:54 pm

There was a thread somewhere about a couple home made valve spring compressor tools recently. I recently bought one for (I think) $40-50 bucks.

Steve

mharney · Post by **mharney** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:17 pm

You can get an in-car version for about 50 bucks. It's not expensive when you think of what you can achieve with it. 50 bucks versus the money you have in heads with dual springs seems like chickenfeed to me.

I bought a bench tool, and in retrospect, I could have gotten it (the same made-in-Taiwan model) for a little more than half what I paid for it if I had shopped around, and I can get the in-car model for just a few dollars more than I paid for this one. I still need the in-car model, and now I am going to get one for about what I paid for the bench model I have.

Moral.. do your homework before you buy.

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:30 pm

Well since you've done the homework, where is the best place to buy an in-car valve spring compressor?

Thanks,
Andy

mharney · Post by **mharney** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:33 pm

Check CIP1, Moore, and Kona Fleming. He quoted me a price close to 50. If you order more than 50 bucks from CIP they pay shipping, so it's about the same. I'm sure there are others close to that.

ACN will rent you one too, btw.

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:55 pm

CB's is cheaper than cip1.com, but the "cylinder head air fitting" isn't included. It is included on the one from cip1.com.
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=1064

So what is the "cylinder head air fitting"?

Thanks,
Andy

Augie · Post by **Augie** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 6:21 pm

That would be a fitting that screws into the spark plug hole with an adadpter to pressurize the cylinder to hold the valves in place so you can use the tool to change springs. I believe it has been said that the same results can be achieved with a piece of rope and the piston at the top.

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 8:27 pm

Well I went ahead and got it through CB simply because they've been good to me recently(although the problem shouldn't have happened in the first place). Is it difficult to use the valve spring compressor(in car) on a bench? What kind of check springs do I need? Where should I get them(I know ac.net has them, but i was hoping local)?

Thanks,
Andy

mharney · Post by **mharney** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 8:33 pm

Something that will hold a couple pounds should do, and just take a retainer cap with you to the hardware store. Find some that are long enough to hold the valve closed. I bought mine from AC.NET but you don't have to do that if you want to get them local, you just need something that will fit.

To use it on a bench you will need some way to secure the head to the bench. There are head stands available different places. This place has them cheap.

http://www.vwalley.com

So far everything I have bought from them is pretty good except the crank gear puller. He's not selling them anymore until he can find a better grade of threadstock for them. I don't like the design anyway.. next time I will buy a puller with the single center drive.

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 9:48 pm

I believe I'd need the "Cylinder Head Press Plate" as opposed to the "Cylinder Head Stand", right?

Thanks,
Andy

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 9:54 pm

By the way, that background music(from vwalley.com) is Dave Brubeck - Take Five.....goooood stuff.

Andy

mharney · Post by **mharney** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:19 pm

I'd guess you could get away with just the stand, or really anything else like it that would secure the head. You're gonna be applying a lot of force though to get those springs compressed. Just keep that in mind if you engineer something.

And yes, that is a midi file of Dave Brubeck. I have the Time Out album with it. Good stuff indeed.

Sharkey · Post by **Sharkey** » Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:52 pm

Augie wrote:That would be a fitting that screws into the spark plug hole with an adadpter to pressurize the cylinder to hold the valves in place so you can use the tool to change springs. I believe it has been said that the same results can be achieved with a piece of rope and the piston at the top.

The air fitting works so much better, though. The old rope trick works better on more traditional engine set-ups where you have easier access to the spark plug holes. I've tried both on an ACVW engine and the air fitting is quicker and easier. You just need a source of compressed air.

And you should put the piston at TDC no matter whether you use an air fitting or rope. It isn't as big of a concern on a horizontally opposed engine but the valves could drop down into the cylinder if the piston is near BDC if you're not careful on any inline or V engine.

Mugsy · Post by **Mugsy** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:04 pm

But with the head stand, wouldn't the springs be facing down(towards the plate) and the combustion chambers up? So I need an air compressor for this?

Thanks,
Andy

mharney · Post by **mharney** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:11 pm

If you put the engine at TDC, be sure and lock the flywheel.