Megasquirt my 2276

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kangaboy
Posts: 773
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2003 3:01 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by kangaboy » Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:00 am

DeathBySnuSnu wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:30 pm
I had the timing of the toothed wheel right.
But.
I had the spark a and the spark b backwards.
Effectively 180 out.
Would having the spark outputs incorrect give you no tach/crank signal though? I feel like that would just make your coils or ignition fire incorrectly.
Some have said not having resistors will be troubles, others have said it shouldn't cause problems. When I was tracking down my crank signal issues, I put in resistor plugs as well. Ended up not being my initial problem, but having them in there now, I avoided any other problems I may have had down the road.
'74 Standard- 1776T, MS3X3
'76 Westy- Stock 2.0L L-Jet

UKLuke72
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:28 pm

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by UKLuke72 » Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:04 pm

Hey Kangaboy,

Put a key to it and turned her over... It has backfired through the carbs once or twice. I now have a cranking trigger...

I have swapped the A and B over...

Should I adhere to the numbering on the coil or should the bottom 2 connect to 1/3 and the top to 2/4
Image


Image
Image

I think my problem is still trigger offset... I have set it at 230°. With the pulley at TDC it has to rotate 230° before it sees tooth #1

Have I got that wrong?

Image

I tried 320º too... That didn't seem to help although I may have my coil paired wrong...

Check out this page of the MSextra
http://www.msextra.com/doc/pdf/html/MS2 ... 4-126.html
Set your engine at TDC, then count the
number of GAPS to tooth#1 in the
direction of rotation (clockwise here) and
multiply by the angular size of the tooth.
e.g. 8 teeth * 10 deg/tooth = 80 deg

Clonebug
Posts: 3315
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by Clonebug » Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm

The missing tooth is supposed to lead the sensor by either 80 or 90 degrees when at TDC.
I know with the EDIS Module it is 90 but with Direct fire it might be 80 degrees.
If you pull the pulley off and turn the hub one more bolt hole farther away you will be much closer to your 80-90 degree target.

I'll bet it will even start.

Once it runs you can lock the timing to 0 degrees in the software setup and confirm your timing. You can then tweak your timing offset to match the timing on the pulley.
Make sure you lock the timing down so you know what number you will be looking for.

As for the coil you have to ignore the numbers except for #1.

A VW fires 1432.
A Ford fires 1342....there in lies the confusion. Put the #1 coil wire on #1 plug. You have two coils with a plug on each end.
So if coil #1 is on plug #1 then the #4 side would go on #3 plug on the VW engine. The other two can go on the left over plugs. Put #2 coil on #2 plug to keep it somewhat sane then the last one goes on #4 plug.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

UKLuke72
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:28 pm

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by UKLuke72 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:37 am

Hmm ok so
Clonebug wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm
The missing tooth is supposed to lead the sensor by either 80 or 90 degrees when at TDC.
I know with the EDIS Module it is 90 but with Direct fire it might be 80 degrees.
I'm not using the EDIS module though... And with direct fire, surely the offset is there to negate whether or not it should lead the sensor by 80º?
Clonebug wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm
If you pull the pulley off and turn the hub one more bolt hole farther away you will be much closer to your 80-90 degree target.
The pulley is at TDC though confirmed on an engine I have in bits... Moving the TDC mark on the pulley will only complicate things firther?
Clonebug wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm
I'll bet it will even start.
It didn't :/
Clonebug wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm

Once it runs you can lock the timing to 0 degrees in the software setup and confirm your timing. You can then tweak your timing offset to match the timing on the pulley.
Make sure you lock the timing down so you know what number you will be looking for.
I tried turning it over with the mrs last night whilst I had a timing light on No1 one just to see where it was at... Couldnt get a spark though and it was late :/
Clonebug wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:44 pm

As for the coil you have to ignore the numbers except for #1.

A VW fires 1432.
A Ford fires 1342....there in lies the confusion. Put the #1 coil wire on #1 plug. You have two coils with a plug on each end.
So if coil #1 is on plug #1 then the #4 side would go on #3 plug on the VW engine. The other two can go on the left over plugs. Put #2 coil on #2 plug to keep it somewhat sane then the last one goes on #4 plug.
Makes sense... I tried

1........4

3........2

Plug

and also

4........2

1........3
Plug

Whilst swapping Spark A and Spark B with both configurations... all of this was done with the trigger offset at 40º

Got a few farts... And a few times it fired on a cylinder that was on it's way up and stopped the engine dead :/

terryly
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:23 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by terryly » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:20 am

Hi Luke I have the same crank wheel and vr sensor from Paul at VW speed shop . I have a running 2180 with ms3pro when i set mine up in tuner studio
under ignition options is set to
trigger wheel.. -36
missing teeth.. -1
tooth #1 angle{deg BTDC.. -52 *******
main wheel speed.. - crankwheel
second trigger active on.. -falling edge
Mine is seqential with ls2 coils near plug so "second trigger active on" may not come up or be highlited
Do not remember how i came up with the tooth angle but could sit down and figure it out again
Hope this helps

Image
Image

Clonebug
Posts: 3315
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by Clonebug » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:58 am

AHHHHH, I see now.

The hub is what has the teeth machined into it.

I thought it had a trigger wheel bolted behind the pulley and you could rotate it anywhere on the pattern but i was wrong. Sorry for the confusion.

When you bought that trigger wheel did it not come with instructions on what the offset would be???? The VR sensor is mounted with the bracket that came with it right????
The builder of the trigger wheel should know what offset it would take to get it close and you could tweak it from there.

When putting plug wires on the coil you have to go through it as a sequence.

Everything in the prior post was assuming you have the coil trigger wires in the correct order.

You will need to confirm you have Spark A on coil 1-4 and spark B on coil 2-3.

Pick which one is coil one and put Spark A on that one. Install Plug #1 on one side of that coil and Plug #3 on the opposite side.

Spark B will be for Plug #4 and #2.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

terryly
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:23 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by terryly » Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:31 am

Ya on mine I went strait to sequential spark and fuel so I had to figure the A,B,C,D coil and injector out puts from the ms3pro and assign them their correct firing order in Tuner studio set up. I did not study batch fire to much. It will be a different setting in Tuner studio

terryly
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:23 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by terryly » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:25 am

]
When you bought that trigger wheel did it not come with instructions on what the offset would be???? The VR sensor is mounted with the bracket that came with it right????
The builder of the trigger wheel should know what offset it would take to get it close and you could tweak it from there.
no instructions but real nice stuff just have to figure it out
Hi clone bug I really like your buggy and turbo EFI journey nice vids I am toying with the idea of going mild boost turbo for my off road car. much research needed

UKLuke72
Here is a vid of my 2180 efi baja
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... UWBb3_ceSM

Terry

UKLuke72
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:28 pm

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by UKLuke72 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:29 am

You guys are the best.

52º and rechecked the pairing, fiddled with the VR polarity and filters bla bla and yeah she struck straight up.

1........4

3........2

Plug

Sorry for the confusion CB... Yeah I should've took a photo like Terry did, no instructions but you do get an online guide... Now it's running I'll need to spend some time tweaking the table for sure... Idling at 19º can't be right, it's just on the stock tune the MS fires up with.

No idea how you came up with 52º but it seems to be about there. :D

terryly
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:23 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by terryly » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:47 am

NICE NICE NICE

UKLuke72
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:28 pm

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by UKLuke72 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:56 am

Thanks Terry!
That BAJA :D

I assumed you were in the UK with parts from Paul... Looks fun!

terryly
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:23 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by terryly » Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:13 am

I liked his throttle bodies and turbo plenums for mud protection on the plus side they should work good for a turbo too :D
Have fun
Terry

Clonebug
Posts: 3315
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: Megasquirt my 2276

Post by Clonebug » Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:22 pm

terryly wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:25 am
]
When you bought that trigger wheel did it not come with instructions on what the offset would be???? The VR sensor is mounted with the bracket that came with it right????
The builder of the trigger wheel should know what offset it would take to get it close and you could tweak it from there.
no instructions but real nice stuff just have to figure it out
Hi clone bug I really like your buggy and turbo EFI journey nice vids I am toying with the idea of going mild boost turbo for my off road car. much research needed

UKLuke72
Here is a vid of my 2180 efi baja
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... UWBb3_ceSM

Terry
Thanks Terry!

Don't kid yourself on a low boost setup.......it's an addiction and you will do anything to get more boost once you start.....😫😁😎

The great thing about EFI is all you need is big enough injectors and you can go higher and higher.
You might have to add WI and/or an intercooler but with a Baja it's doable....
Go for it!!!!
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

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