VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Moderator: Tom Notch

Post Reply
gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:31 am

Hello - I searched, but since VFR is too short a word to search, didn't come up with much.

Anyway, I just bought (an awesome) VW 412 with a 2056 and SDS engine management. It is currently using a stock-based intake plenum, manifolds and throttle body (though with a lot of work to make them function with the SDS).

I would like to swap to ITBs, using IDF manfolds with the rubber boot adapters. I would also like to use the VFR injectors, which are high resistance. I'm having a hard time finding flow rates, but expect they have LOTS of headroom for a 115hp Type 4 - the bike made similar power and they usually have headroom for mods.

Because the VFR ITBs are popular, I was just wondering if anyone has used the injectors and their experience?
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

User avatar
andy198712
Posts: 1723
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by andy198712 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:25 pm

wether it helps or not but i use GSXR750 ITBs and the smaller of the two injectors(they have staged injection) and they work fine and safely within limits on my 2110cc

gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:56 pm

Heh, at least it makes me feel better.
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

User avatar
andy198712
Posts: 1723
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by andy198712 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:44 am

And they had two sets of injectors, lower ones were small and uppers were huge, and I just used the small ones.... I reckon you’ll be fine :)

Clonebug
Posts: 3395
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by Clonebug » Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:08 am

andy198712 wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:44 am
And they had two sets of injectors, lower ones were small and uppers were huge, and I just used the small ones.... I reckon you’ll be fine :)
You will still need to know the flow numbers of the injectors to set up your ECU parameters.

I have to tell MS what size the injectors are as far as CC's/min.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:28 am

I've found out they are 28lb/hr or 294cc/min. They are a little bigger than the 24lb/hr ones being used currently, so shouldn't be a night and day difference in tuning (I hope).
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

User avatar
andy198712
Posts: 1723
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by andy198712 » Sat Mar 31, 2018 5:35 am

Clonebug wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:08 am
andy198712 wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:44 am
And they had two sets of injectors, lower ones were small and uppers were huge, and I just used the small ones.... I reckon you’ll be fine :)
You will still need to know the flow numbers of the injectors to set up your ECU parameters.

I have to tell MS what size the injectors are as far as CC's/min.
yes very true, which "should" take out the retuning aspect for you...... or at least be close

Clonebug
Posts: 3395
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by Clonebug » Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:20 am

gearheadgreg wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:28 am
I've found out they are 28lb/hr or 294cc/min. They are a little bigger than the 24lb/hr ones being used currently, so shouldn't be a night and day difference in tuning (I hope).
Probably good for about 180 hp on a 4 cylinder at 80% DC.
Maybe a little less with a turbo.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Sun Apr 01, 2018 8:42 am

Clonebug wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:20 am
Probably good for about 180 hp on a 4 cylinder at 80% DC.
Maybe a little less with a turbo.
That's what I found as well. For an engine rated at around 115hp, maybe another 5-10hp with the ITBs, that's plenty of headroom. Hopefully not too big as to make the idle iffy. Just make it sound like it has a big cam if it does! Heh.
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

Clonebug
Posts: 3395
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:28 am

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by Clonebug » Sun Apr 01, 2018 11:26 am

gearheadgreg wrote:
Sun Apr 01, 2018 8:42 am
Clonebug wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:20 am
Probably good for about 180 hp on a 4 cylinder at 80% DC.
Maybe a little less with a turbo.
That's what I found as well. For an engine rated at around 115hp, maybe another 5-10hp with the ITBs, that's plenty of headroom. Hopefully not too big as to make the idle iffy. Just make it sound like it has a big cam if it does! Heh.
You should be fine......I run injectors that support 360 hp on my 1679cc engine and Chip has some super duper ID massive injectors on his without any idle or driving issues.
Get a set of injectors that will support the max hp you would ever hope to reach. That way you won't have to buy them twice.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.

gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Sun Apr 01, 2018 12:42 pm

Yeah, I think it will be totally fine. The only plans I have for this engine are the ITBs and manifolds, so 180hp will be more than enough for ever.
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

TZepeSH
Posts: 235
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by TZepeSH » Sun Apr 01, 2018 2:03 pm

Very good to know the flow rate! I wad looking for this info and never found it. Max Welton posted some time ago the flow rate of his injectors after cleaning, but i think pictures are lost and the test pressure was not specified. Msybe check his thread, and do a search by keyword vfr800, there were some more topics.

gearheadgreg
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:25 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Contact:

Re: VFR Throttle Bodies AND Injectors?

Post by gearheadgreg » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:37 am

I'm going to try and clean mine with solvent spraying through, then a bath in the ultrasonic. We'll see.

So now I've got the throttle bodies, the velocity stacks, manifolds, and I have lots of extra air cleaners around from various carbs and projects - I might try to make airboxes with air ducted to them. Also, since my neighbor is a bicycle brake engineer, I'll use his help to make a cable pull setup for the ITBs.
Dealer for Alloy Wheels & Period H4s and Fog/Driving Lights

http://www.greggearhead.com

Post Reply