Ignition only table?

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supaninja
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by supaninja » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:25 pm

Keep updating us Andy, this has been a very informative experiment :shock:
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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Aug 19, 2012 4:21 am

indeed it has!

i think part of my running hot issues was using the tinare with holes in it for the heater pipes.... since blocking those it has helped alot..... i'm going to check the plugs today and see where i'm at.

problem i had with the leaner jet was when cold started, it would start ok, but where i live i have to pull away up a hill and it wouldnt let me change into second at mid rpm, would splutter alot if i did, its now fine being richer.... and reving high enough to make the change wasnt appealing on a cold engine.

this is due to me not using the choke, which i think helps my mpg no end! using the ignition map to hold the idle.

would also help to tune the carb i guess.... just dont have an o2 sensor (yet)so its poking in the dark i guess!

tempting to fiddle the map a bit more, not sure wether to get more advance in sooner or just try and increase all but WOT by a couple degrees maybe and see if i gain or loose anything....

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Thu Aug 23, 2012 4:57 pm

Well I had a bit of a tweek on the map, and tried my old favourite carb the 30 pict 1 but it would rev out, only had about 3/4 revs when flooring it, I didn't play with it long, tried the 112 and 120 jet and didn't change much so switched back to my 30 pict 3 which I'd cleaned out the adjustment screws ect.... Put them back in the same position but it didn't run the same..... At which point I'm wonder why I bothered to change the carb lol
Bit more fiddling and it holding idle cold again now....

Really need an O2 sensor!!

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:18 am

filled up again...

36.16 mpg, and that was with changing carbs about and loosing about 2-3 bowl fulls of petrol. quite pleased with that, especially when fuel is about £1.40 a litre!

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supaninja
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by supaninja » Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:01 pm

andy198712 wrote:filled up again...

36.16 mpg, and that was with changing carbs about and loosing about 2-3 bowl fulls of petrol. quite pleased with that, especially when fuel is about £1.40 a litre!
That is amazing :shock: , I wonder what fuel injection will yield?
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Piledriver
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by Piledriver » Sun Aug 26, 2012 12:00 am

supaninja wrote:
andy198712 wrote:filled up again...

36.16 mpg, and that was with changing carbs about and loosing about 2-3 bowl fulls of petrol. quite pleased with that, especially when fuel is about £1.40 a litre!
That is amazing :shock: , I wonder what fuel injection will yield?
It might do worse. Seriously.
Esp. if he has single port heads and has to use the sequential+siamese code and big injectors to get around the siamese ports.
(I have no idea how a 1200 cc late model Euro T1 is setup)

If he has working manifold heat, he probably has excellent fuel/air mixing going on.
He just lacks fine AFR control.

From a pure economy standpoint, the closes equivalent would be a TBi setup on the factory carb heated manifold, perhaps even installing a venturi or such and pre-mixing the fuel entering the TB.
(or even sticking an injector aiming down from the air cleaner at a carb w/plugged jets)
Then you could play silly buggers with the AFR/timing to see how deep the rabbit hole really goes.
More CR and a good (small) tuned exhaust would probably go a LONG way.

I pushed >50 MPG on a "custom" (emergency duct tape throw together on a weekend after swallowing a valve through an aluminum keeper) 800cc twin with a PICT 28 w/matching vacuum only advance dist back in high school.

It would do 56mph on a flat surface at WOT, but I did not have to ride the bus to school.
Last edited by Piledriver on Sun Aug 26, 2012 12:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Aug 26, 2012 2:21 am

supaninja wrote:
andy198712 wrote:filled up again...

36.16 mpg, and that was with changing carbs about and loosing about 2-3 bowl fulls of petrol. quite pleased with that, especially when fuel is about £1.40 a litre!
That is amazing :shock: , I wonder what fuel injection will yield?

if i didnt have so much money in my 2110 i'd FI my 1200, be great to see!

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Aug 26, 2012 2:24 am

Piledriver wrote:
supaninja wrote:
andy198712 wrote:filled up again...

36.16 mpg, and that was with changing carbs about and loosing about 2-3 bowl fulls of petrol. quite pleased with that, especially when fuel is about £1.40 a litre!
That is amazing :shock: , I wonder what fuel injection will yield?
It might do worse. Seriously.
Esp. if he has single port heads and has to use the sequential+siamese code and big injectors to get around the siamese ports.
(I have no idea how a 1200 cc late model Euro T1 is setup)

If he has working manifold heat, he probably has excellent fuel/air mixing going on.
He just lacks fine AFR control.

From a pure economy standpoint, the closes equivalent would be a TBi setup on the factory carb heated manifold, perhaps even installing a venturi or such and pre-mixing the fuel entering the TB.
(or even sticking an injector aiming down from the air cleaner at a carb w/plugged jets)
Then you could play silly buggers with the AFR/timing to see how deep the rabbit hole really goes.
More CR and a good (small) tuned exhaust would probably go a LONG way.

I pushed >50 MPG on a "custom" (emergency duct tape throw together on a weekend after swallowing a valve through an aluminum keeper) 800cc twin with a PICT 28 w/matching vacuum only advance dist back in high school.

It would do 56mph on a flat surface at WOT, but I did not have to ride the bus to school.
if i did it, i would definitely use a twinport 1300 head (euro models), that way i could bolt on any of the EFI manifolds :)
maybe use a destroked counter weighted crank as the 1200 crank is weaker, light valve train, straight cuts (purely for low friction) and a cam that matched the combo.....

i do think with EFI i could break into the 40's easily...... but breaking the 50's would be some challenge and achievment!

i've got most of the parts to build a 1200 barring a case in the garage....

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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by 13window » Sun Aug 26, 2012 4:20 am

stop playing with the big motor and build up a 1200 with fi be good to see the out come.

I thinking of doing the same to caths bug but with a turbo to help get up the hills around here :lol: :lol:

Did you make it over to the jambo on sat??? I had to much work on :( :(

sam

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Aug 26, 2012 5:57 am

13window wrote:stop playing with the big motor and build up a 1200 with fi be good to see the out come.

I thinking of doing the same to caths bug but with a turbo to help get up the hills around here :lol: :lol:

Did you make it over to the jambo on sat??? I had to much work on :( :(

sam

:mrgreen:

i wouldnt hear the end of it, already got engine bits all over the house :lol:

wally got 150bhp from his TP1200 T i think? lol

yeah, got soaked and wasnt amazing.... i think today would have been the better day to go!

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Mon Aug 27, 2012 7:01 am

Image

my current map

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panel
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by panel » Sat Sep 01, 2012 6:39 pm

panel wrote:You could also put your 110KPA up in the top (12th) row. Maybe better resolution ?
Still haven't done that yet eh :lol: (Or 100KPA)

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:24 am

panel wrote:
panel wrote:You could also put your 110KPA up in the top (12th) row. Maybe better resolution ?
Still haven't done that yet eh :lol: (Or 100KPA)

i'm getting there though 8) from 80 up i've gone up in 5's instead of tens but will go further ;)

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andy198712
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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by andy198712 » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:57 pm

new map

Image

tried more max advance but from 45 to 55 in top gear these seemed to be about 7 seconds down from 9 ish in the old map. no pinging i could hear... is this safe? i dont normally do full throttle tbh

cheers

ps, hows that panel? ;)

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Re: Ignotion only table?

Post by Steve Arndt » Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:48 pm

What happens when you hit a cell over 100 Kpa with the map stopping at 100? Does it just continue with the highest known value?
I'm naturally aspirated, and hit well over 105 Kpa during low 90 Kpa barometric conditions. At sea level I would be touching into 115 Kpa cells.

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