This is sort of like that other post. But here I hope to run a large positive offset rim, not a "deep dish"
any ways I talked to a few at the german look forums and the general responce was that with wider rims you'll have to space the wheel away from the trailing arms to clear parts.
so now that your wheels are further out than normal, you should narrow the beam to pull them back in.
Now heres the problem, this seems like it will work but I was hoping to get some responces here about the turning abilities. With this sort of combination will I lose a lot of turning? I hope to be able to make u turns and stuff still.
what do you guys think
thanks
rip
narrowed beams and wide wheels
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Re: narrowed beams and wide wheels
yup.Rip wrote: With this sort of combination will I lose a lot of turning?
have you considered wider fenders?
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well I was hoping it wouldn't be to bad. I don't mind the idea of wider fenders, but don't want to much. Wider looks better in the rear fenders than in the front, if you ask me so thats why I'm hoping this will make with out to much trouble.
cb spindle will add 1/4 inch each side
plus the rim will need a spacer depending on the off set about +-1/4
plus I believe the brake mods I hop to do will add about a 1/8
I'm looking at adding a little more than a 1/2" on each side.
Now with a 2" narrowed beam by CB I just pulled in the wheels less than a 1/2. So shouldn't it be like a 1"narrowed beam?
Also this is a seperate question but related, does wider wheels alone cause a increased turning radius?
thanks
rip
cb spindle will add 1/4 inch each side
plus the rim will need a spacer depending on the off set about +-1/4
plus I believe the brake mods I hop to do will add about a 1/8
I'm looking at adding a little more than a 1/2" on each side.
Now with a 2" narrowed beam by CB I just pulled in the wheels less than a 1/2. So shouldn't it be like a 1"narrowed beam?
Also this is a seperate question but related, does wider wheels alone cause a increased turning radius?
thanks
rip
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A narrowed beam doesn't improve your turning radius under all circumstances. If you're going to run a wheel that's already got all the backspace it can have before hitting things and it sticks out of the fender, the only way to even maintain the steering radius while tucking the tire under the fender is to run wider fenders. Narrowing the beam will tuck the tire, but you'll have to limit your steering stops so that the tires don't hit the body in the fenderwells.
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Son of Marc
Son of Marc
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Wider wheels alone do not change the turning radius, but assuming they've got more frontspace than a stock wheel they're likely to have more 'scrub radius' - which means the steering effort is going to be harder at slow speed.Rip wrote:Also this is a seperate question but related, does wider wheels alone cause a increased turning radius?
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Son of Marc
Son of Marc
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cool so if I can keep a wheel at about the stock distance from center I should have close to a stock turning circle.
Narrowing the beam will tuck the tire, but you'll have to limit your steering stops so that the tires don't hit the body in the fenderwells.
yep so if I run wider tires I'll have problems with tires rubbing. So hopfully I can space out the rim so the steering stops are the same as stock.
All in all, if I use a wider wheel I have one main issue since that alone should not affect the turning circle, even though it may be harder in low speeds. My clearance with other components is the problem, if I can space the wheel and tires far enough out to not interfer with the components I should be fine.
Now instead of just spacing the wheel far out, out past the fender. I can use a narrowed beam to pull the wheels in. In though only as far out as I need to space the wheel out.
this seem right? Only use a narrowed beam to offset the extra spacing I need to fit the larger wheel?
thanks
rip
Narrowing the beam will tuck the tire, but you'll have to limit your steering stops so that the tires don't hit the body in the fenderwells.
yep so if I run wider tires I'll have problems with tires rubbing. So hopfully I can space out the rim so the steering stops are the same as stock.
All in all, if I use a wider wheel I have one main issue since that alone should not affect the turning circle, even though it may be harder in low speeds. My clearance with other components is the problem, if I can space the wheel and tires far enough out to not interfer with the components I should be fine.
Now instead of just spacing the wheel far out, out past the fender. I can use a narrowed beam to pull the wheels in. In though only as far out as I need to space the wheel out.
this seem right? Only use a narrowed beam to offset the extra spacing I need to fit the larger wheel?
thanks
rip
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Check out the clearance between the inner sidewall and the body at the rear when the wheel's turned full lock. Now look at the clearance between the opposite wheel and the trailing arm, beam, and balljoint at the front. When you narrow the beam EVERYTHING comes in - clearance is unchanged at the front and reduced at the rear, so the turning circle can only be larger with the same rim backspace. Reduce the backspace (or add spacers) and the clearance at the rear is restored; you've gained clearance at the front, but the minimum turning circle is still going to be controlled by the amount of clearance available at the rear.
When you move the center of the tire's contact patch outboard in relation to the steering axis center by adding spacers or reducing rim offset, the "scrub radius" becomes greater. This increases steering wheel effort at very low speeds and makes the car more likely to dart about when the front tires encounter irregularities in the pavement; taken to extreme it also can cause fender clearance problems as the outside edge of the tire will move forward in the wheelwell when turned in, and rearward when turned out.
When you move the center of the tire's contact patch outboard in relation to the steering axis center by adding spacers or reducing rim offset, the "scrub radius" becomes greater. This increases steering wheel effort at very low speeds and makes the car more likely to dart about when the front tires encounter irregularities in the pavement; taken to extreme it also can cause fender clearance problems as the outside edge of the tire will move forward in the wheelwell when turned in, and rearward when turned out.
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Note To Self: drive fast around corners it will be easier
Thanks so let me see if I got this straight. I need to watch the rear clearance. That the turning circle is determined by the angle that one can turn the wheel. And to keep stock turning I need to keep the rear clearance and the same angle. That if I want to use a wider rim I should actually use a ?deep dish? styled rim to keep the clearance at the rear of the tire and the inner-fender-well the same.
Unfortunately this will create new problems with the clearance at the fender to tire. But that?s the general idea right?
If that?s right, I need to find a way to keep the turning angle of the wheel and the rear clearance the same while making sure that the wheel will fit under the fender. So I need to find a combination of narrowed beam, spacers, and rim offset to make this work.
-need to find a good rim size figured something like 17x7 ET 38-42
-need to find the size of spacers needed to retain clearance with components and provide the good angle
-lastly need to narrow to beam to pull the wheels in, to tuck the wheels in while leaving the angle alone
Sound good?
Thanks again for all the help
Rip
Thanks so let me see if I got this straight. I need to watch the rear clearance. That the turning circle is determined by the angle that one can turn the wheel. And to keep stock turning I need to keep the rear clearance and the same angle. That if I want to use a wider rim I should actually use a ?deep dish? styled rim to keep the clearance at the rear of the tire and the inner-fender-well the same.
Unfortunately this will create new problems with the clearance at the fender to tire. But that?s the general idea right?
If that?s right, I need to find a way to keep the turning angle of the wheel and the rear clearance the same while making sure that the wheel will fit under the fender. So I need to find a combination of narrowed beam, spacers, and rim offset to make this work.
-need to find a good rim size figured something like 17x7 ET 38-42
-need to find the size of spacers needed to retain clearance with components and provide the good angle
-lastly need to narrow to beam to pull the wheels in, to tuck the wheels in while leaving the angle alone
Sound good?
Thanks again for all the help
Rip
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My experience tells me no 7" wheel will fit with any combination of suspension/brake components under the front of a BJ bug with stock late model fenders and the standard turning radius.
I have put 5.5-6" wide wheels under the front of a couple of bugs a couple of times and they even take limiting the stops a little AND come as close to the fenders as you want to come, if not a little too close.
If you want to have the stock turning radius and have 7" wide wheels you'll need wider front fenders.
I have put 5.5-6" wide wheels under the front of a couple of bugs a couple of times and they even take limiting the stops a little AND come as close to the fenders as you want to come, if not a little too close.
If you want to have the stock turning radius and have 7" wide wheels you'll need wider front fenders.
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Son of Marc
Son of Marc
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Chris V wrote:My experience tells me no 7" wheel will fit with any combination of suspension/brake components under the front of a BJ bug with stock late model fenders and the standard turning radius.
I have put 5.5-6" wide wheels under the front of a couple of bugs a couple of times and they even take limiting the stops a little AND come as close to the fenders as you want to come, if not a little too close.
If you want to have the stock turning radius and have 7" wide wheels you'll need wider front fenders.
dang, well how close to stock can someone get? 80% 90%? Is it somthing that a daily driver can put up with. I'd like to still be able to do a "U" turn on the road. is this possible?
Does this mean no narrowed beam? But instead wider fenders? Any suggestions?
Guess I'll start look at the CCC web site and the samba to see some wider fenders on car and see how it looks.
thanks again for the help guys I really do appreciate the time.
Rip