aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

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681tonburb
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by 681tonburb » Sat May 21, 2016 4:16 pm

I seen ORD sells king resistors for 20 don't know if thats cheap but fox are almost 100

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Piledriver
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Sat May 21, 2016 4:27 pm

I'll hit Kings website, looked all over the other day.
That would be a "lets see if it works" sub project, and the external res isn't really needed, but allows some adjust-ability.
(There's no reason it won't work)
681tonburb wrote: Wheels with the Porsche patter you have to get a second mortgage to get .

I disagree.

I got a set of 16" forged 944 7 slots in ET 52.5 for $200., available in et 65 for 928 as well, and in 6/7/8" widths.
I could have has a set of 7" ET23 cookie cutters for the same price @same time, should have snagged them but I couldn't use them on the T3 project and impossible to justify to SWMBO.
Would have worked great on the GT flared 914 at least.

Cast "repros" are as cheap in 5x130 as anything else, and factory Boxster rims are as common as salt.
You get what you pay for quality wise, folks don't pay a premium for Porsche rims ONLY because they fit, esp the forged ones... They are better quality than 99% of aftermarket and even most OEM rims.

If you want to convert to 5x5, I'd stick with the steel rear arms and consider Chevy or Pinto front spindle stubs & hubs, and use Chevy brakes, or at least rotors.
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Steve Arndt » Sat May 21, 2016 5:03 pm

681tonburb wrote: What if I turn the brake drum down to use as the hub and put a disk over it finding a disk with the right off set meat be a chalanger I have a set of rotors from a g35 at the house there 5 on 4.5 like ford that would open up a lot of off the shelf wheel choices . Wheels with the Porsche patter you have to get a second mortgage to get .
Not sure on drum, but many people have turned down front ghia rotors to act as a hub. Need to get 5x130 rotors of course, or machine yours. Then you just slip the porsche rotors over the studs of the "hub".

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Sat May 21, 2016 9:33 pm

If you look on page 1 of this thread, those are ancient, worn out original VW rotors (for a 914 but it really doesn't matter) turned down into hubs, and drilled/spot faced for 5x130.
They are pretty sturdy and thick where the studs go, and machined like pretty awesome iron.

They run absolutely true as I turned down the 83mmish VW hubcentric bit to 73.something mm Porsche size, and the Porsche adapters center perfectly on the hub, hence the wheels center on the adapters perfectly.

A large part of my drive for project this was not being able to get new, stock, hubcentric front rotors, guaranteed.
Early 914s didn't have it, but later T1s and T3s did, and it matters.

You should never center on the studs if you can avoid it, I even modded my t3 rear hubs to be hubcentric.
If the road is smooth, so is the car. No funny suspension/drivetrain vibrations at all.

Note the adapters are also hat mounts on the Wilwood setup, and also center the hat.
The spacers were needed for the high offset wheels, and also allow the cheap steel 3" hats and 8x7 rotors and a happy consequence.

I have a set of turned down hubs I did on a lathe, but don't like how thin they ended up near the inner race when trued up to allow machining the face.

I have been driving on these modded stock discs for awhile, and when the early calipers modded for wilwoods are ready (if I can get past SWMBOs new list for tomorrow) they will meet either Godzilla the plasma cutter or mr cut off wheel, but the latters not as much as much fun, and a lot slower. After being cut to size they will be ready to go 5x130 hubs, and get the steel wilwood hats and vented rotors as pictured.

Reminds my I need to carefully verify the 914 rotor face is the same distance as T3 (early T4) vs the spindle backing/caliper mount before welding the new mounts on the early spindles
(The rotor offsets differed early<>late 914 by ~3mm but the rotor/hat parts won't exist anymore.
The Late T3s used early 914/411 rotors)
Last edited by Piledriver on Sat May 21, 2016 10:01 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Marc » Sat May 21, 2016 9:52 pm

Piledriver wrote:...factory Boxster rims are as common as salt.
You get what you pay for quality wise, folks don't pay a premium for Porsche rims ONLY because they fit, esp the forged ones... They are better quality than 99% of aftermarket and even most OEM rims...
Agreed, there are lots of OEM Porsche rims out there - Boxter 16 & 17" in particular - which can be had for surprisingly cheap...I guess the typical Porsche owner doesn't have the storage space at his condo to keep them following an upgrade ;)

The widths which we're usually after for VWs are considered narrow by the Porsche crowd so there's not much market for them which keeps the price very attractive compared to many aftermarket rims, and the quality is fantastic.

The caveat is that as a rule Porsche rims will have too much backspace for VW applications so you usually will need 2 or 4 spacers, and unless you can get away with the fairly thin ones that were stock on 924/944 (so they're common in the boneyard) be prepared to lay out some coin for those.

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by 681tonburb » Sat May 21, 2016 9:57 pm

Man you guys must have more Porsches then we do in Fl cookie cutters go for more then a hole 944 do hear it's hard to get any thing cheap hear and most of the newer Porsche wheels would look out of place on my avenger .

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Sat May 21, 2016 10:35 pm

Took a look on Google images for folks Avenger GT12 pics (LOTS), I'm kinda partial to this color scheme, not many cars could pull it off like that , but I suspect modern rims would not be an issue, esp if they had polished lips and centers painted like this one...

http://www.klassicrides.com/Project/294/1
I suspect this VW powered one above later got converted to the mid engined vette tube chassis, or the fellow later built an externally identical car mid engined with a 283.

I'd probably want to channel the lower body 3 inches, lower in back esp, and move everything internal up, thats the main thing that makes it look "not GT40". and maybe switch to 7" round headlights.

The fellow who makes the tubular mid-engine `vette chassis makes them for the Avenger as well.
Seems like it would be an interesting marriage, which is probably the most fun. :twisted:
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Sun May 22, 2016 12:13 am

BTW, finally looked and found the tiny manufacturers logo on the 7 slot forged AKA flat discs AKA manhole covers.
Fuchs. (Stylized foxes face from front, wasn't 100% sure until i found the old logo online.)

I guess there weren't a lot of companies making forged aluminum wheels in the 80s, still aren't, so not much of a surprise.
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by 681tonburb » Sun May 22, 2016 12:44 am

Ya here is I think 3 of those cars with that paint job one Jeff stretched his and pit an automatic trans in it. There were two bodies from fiber fab one the vw you see there a Nd one on a tube frame set up for a corvair trans and v8 power mod engine style . You can't put a v8 in a vw one even with a v6 if it's mid enginge there just isn't enough room . My car now has the old style adaptors so I can run the Chevy 5x4.75 wheels. I was going to get cookie cutter wheels and have them put in new rims to get the size and look I want but for the price to get the wheels then redothen I can just have CW make me a set of wheels if I go to Chevy or ford I can walk in to any tire store and find something off the shelf that will work and have a look that I like .

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Marc » Sun May 22, 2016 1:18 am

681tonburb wrote:Man you guys must have more Porsches then we do in Fl cookie cutters go for more then a hole 944 do hear it's hard to get any thing cheap hear and most of the newer Porsche wheels would look out of place on my avenger .
"Classic" Porsche rims like Cookie Cutters/Fuchs are a whole 'nuther story - their price stays stratospheric precisely because there's a huge market for them from all of the VW guys wanting them. I'm talking about Boxter rims, and there's quite a variety in those. The 18/19/20" ones still bring quite a bit, but the older 16 and 17" can be had for less than a set of aftermarket rims: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=boxter+rims&t ... &ia=images


I paid less than this per set for all three sets of mine - this is just an example of what's on eBay today (6 & 7" x16"):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-986-Box ... 2114242432
7 & 8½" x17" with tires/free shipping:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/98-Boxster-RWD- ... 2247575154

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Sun May 22, 2016 4:39 am

I'm probably keeping the 944T/928 front calipers after all, as it was a smoking price and they are in great shape.
Evil plan is those will go on the back of the 914.
They are 40x36x28mm, but they'll fit the 1994 911 Turbo rear rotors I just scored a pair of for $28, shipped.(for both---
from two sources, if they used the same drop shipper one will cancel as they were both "last one")
Can be had cheap anyway.

Cant find a set of he "right" ones for a reasonable price, but the 996T rears I have are same piston size, and look trivial to mount...
They are even black.

94 911 turbo rear rotor is same offset (ok 2mm more, can deal with that easily) as the 944T rears, almost tempted to use the setup out back, but they'd be way too much for the 1.25" front superlites unless i went to 13" front rotors, then it gets seriously dubious as to fitting in the 16" 7 slots.

The 914 will roll on 18s, so no issue. Will probably pick up a set of superlites with 1.75" pistons (hard not to) as the calculators say thats a good combo with the the ~50/50ish 914 weight distribution.(944/928 fronts out back on 28mm x 298mm rotors and 1.75" superlites up front, probably on 11.75 or next size up in rotors)

So the brake setup is set:
1.25" 4 piston superlites up front on 11.75" x 1.25 rotors (have) on steel hats, rear and 30x28mm 4 piston 996/Boxster S rears out back on std 944 turbo 24mm rotors with adapters (have/can make in an hour)...
... that could simply be 1" angle iron if it was only thicker. (might work with some stiffening fillets welded in, but cheesy, needs to be at least 1/4" thick, a ~1" bit of aluminum bar stock would be ideal.)
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Bruce.m » Sun May 22, 2016 3:28 pm

Ali is easier to drill & tap (1 1/4" I think). Although I used a helicoil thread to make it more robust.

Image

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by Piledriver » Mon May 23, 2016 1:01 am

I cheated and just bought a clean looking (full) set of 944T//928S calipers off TOS classifieds, paid a LOT less than Ebay.
The "rears" that turned out to be front calipers are boxed up and ready to drop of in the AM, and the refund (including shipping as it was an absolute "not as described") will largely pay for the full set.

This probably only defers the 996 rears going on the square, as I may use the full 944 set on the 914, as it also has a ~50/50 weight distribution, so likely reasonable bias match.
It's still going to be a ~2200 lb car, so even the 944 Turbo brakes will be overkill.
(have a 911 parking brake setup that fits the 914 setup with only minor work)

The fact you can still get the Mintex "red box" 930 pads (D345/D608 pattern) dirt cheap helps a lot financially, as F&R take same pads, and they are allegedly great pads for street or AX or even some light track duty.

After finishing SWMBOs latest tasks, donned the headlight and did some poking around, popped apart the RR Four-Way shock to test fit the spring setup on the KYBs...

The Monroes were toast, at least RR, rebound force was about 10X compression.
The front end is also noticeably bouncier for the last couple of weeks, haven't gone into it yet.
(will get the second pair of KYBs, probably with thinner or at least better shock oil, at least)

What effect does varying a monotube shocks gas pressure have, all else being the same?
Just more spring effect?

The KYBs are 36mm rather than 1 5/8", so I had to shim under the clamp on spring mounts.
Fortunately KYB provided some great shim stock in the form of the removed dust cover, that and some .007" SS real shim stock and we have a good clamp on setup again.

May throw a few coil over snap ring grooves on so i can clamp to the snap ring wires...
...Or just stick the Bilstein SG series shock coil over kits on the KYBs.
Last edited by Piledriver on Mon May 23, 2016 2:04 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by 681tonburb » Mon May 23, 2016 1:22 am

Ya I was just looking there seen the guy selling the calipers for $75 each. The adaptors look good. I get home tomarrow and I'm hoping I can find some time to pull all my parts out and work on them.

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Re: aluminum 944 arms--- what shocks? Brakes?

Post by 681tonburb » Mon May 23, 2016 9:47 pm

Are you still planing on using the torsion spring or will you be going to just a coil over. I grabbed the 944 end plates since they have some adjustment to them but I may not use them and just go coilover

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