For those of you running the original two-pin ATE or aftermarket VARGA caliper that came on the 72-73 Ghia, Porterfield makes an excellent high-performance pad.
The pad shown here is identified by the Porterfield part number AP-30, which is the same pad used on a long list of Alfa Romeos for racing. Here is the link to the Porterfield website specific to our VW needs. The R4 is listed at about $50 a set of four, and the R4S for about $100 per set. Scroll up to the top of the page. Porterfield uses our Ghia as the VW racing example. The AP-30's are under Alfa Romeo.
Hmmm.. Who would you go to for a compatible brake shoe reline?
(Googling for Porterfield pads for a BMW 2002Ti now)
My app is a T3, but the question applies to all...
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
On the page to where the link takes you, Porterfield states they will make special brake pads, but do not mention relining shoes.
Back in the bad old days, I used to have local clutch/brake shops here in Birmingham (a big NASCAR fabrication site back then, under the Allisons) line our shoes with NASCAR material.
You might find a clutch/brake rebuilder in your area and ask them what is the "racing lining" they have, and go from there.
Just keep in mind the racing stuff (including the R4S pads) has to get hot to work. We get great stopping power and no-fade service out of just the R4S compound.
Figured, I just want to get away from the ultra-fast wear low-friction mystery lining on all the available off the shelf units...
...half the time they aren't even bonded well, went through 3 boxes the other day and they ~all sucked and had half the meat of the shoes I'm trying to replace
I can get just about any material in pads for the BMW fronts, but trying to get the rear to keep up and not require constant adjustment is becoming a PITA (but it sure stops now when it's right, still better than stock when not, still trying to figure out wtf, perhaps I've just been running F&R discs too long)
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
We just converted our road race '73 Super (we've taken to calling it the "Super RS" ) to 4-wheel disks. They are EMPI, and the front brakes are definitely the 2-pin ATE/Varga style pads that you pictured. However, the rear pads are totally different. I thought I read somewhere that this is the same pattern as some of the older SAAB sedans but am not too sure. We are eager to get some Porterfield pads for race use but want to make sure we order the correct ones. I realize we can give them tracings and have them custom made but I imagine that would be a bit pricier. Anyone recognize this pad pattern (that is a 1 1/2" bolt for reference)?
Some good news. Our experience with rear disks (and drums) is that a good quality rear pad works if you have the Porterfields or similiar genuine high performace pads up front.
We've done this enough to advise that you can get by with "stock" rear pads. Just have two sets ... and in practice, "season" (burn-in) both front and rear sets in fifteen-minute runs, going through the usual gradual braking and backing off for cooling phases.
If you're street legal, you can season in the pads before race day.
Take your rear pads to an auto parts store and see if they recognize them. These disk brake conversion pads are usually off a Ford Fiesta, VW Polo, maybe even the current small Chevys.
Or send Porterfield a tracing and ask them if they have a pad to match -- don't ask for custom work.
We have stayed with the Varga calipers front and rear to avoid the "mystery pad" problem.
Hot, humid air is less dense than cooler, drier air. This can allow a golf ball to fly through the air with greater ease, as there won't be as much resistance on the ball.
It can be set up as your default pdf viewer, probably 10-20X faster than Adobes ridiculous Adobe Reader, depending on your computer.
I've been running this on the Windows boxes I have to use at work, huge improvement.
(On Linux--- no gain vs ghostscript and it's usual viewer apps, Google probably just embedded GS in Chrome)
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
David58's EBC (European Brake Company) catalog shows "Greenstuff Street Sport" pads, part number DP2105, fitting our ATE/VARGA calipers. EBC cites the pads size as 56mm wide x 53mm high x 15mm thick when new.
HAWK, another big performance braking supplier, offers nothing.
Greenstuff, Yellowsuff, Redstuff, etc. are actually names EBC uses to brand its different pad materials. The EBC color-coded names are so much a part of many racer's jargon these days that I've met a few who think they are generic titles.
Greenstuff is a Aramid-based pad, meaning like the Porterfield, it contains Kevlar.
Not having used EBC pads I can't say how they perform, but I suspect they are similiar to the Porterfield R4S series. Porterfield's advantage here is they offer the full-race R4 pad, something EBC does not do.
Hey FJ, do pad recommendations change if I'm using plate steel instead of cast iron rotors?
I made my own custom brakes out of 7075 hubs and blanchard ground hotrolled plate rotors. I'll get some pictures up in a new thread soon, they came out really nice.
Also, can you confirm that the pads that work on the 2 pin Varga calipers (for the FRONT) are the REAR pads for the Alfa's? Just want to make sure for when I order pads, it would be cool to have red or green stuff from EBC.
No difference in pad material for steel or cast iron.
And yes, the 2-pin ATE front caliper used on the Ghias is the same rear caliper used on some Alfas. But be forewarned. The Italians changed parts on whims. Up to an including wiring diagram color codes as the harness passed through a firewall. I say this with experience beaten into me by Lancia.
I don't have enough Type 3 experience to confirm. There is a possibility the Type 3 pad, or piston, might be a little smaller even though the calipers look alike.
[quote="ToRy 70"]Here's a pic of the final install. Got some EBC redstuff pads in there too. I can confirm that part number DP3105C fits our front two-pin calipers. For car model, I selected a 1970 Alfa Romeo Montreal REAR pads. DP2105 is the same, but greenstuff. UD030 is the ultimax generic. I'll give an update on performance when these are broken in.
) to 4-wheel disks. They are EMPI, and the front brakes are definitely the 2-pin ATE/Varga style pads that you pictured. However, the rear pads are totally different. I thought I read somewhere that this is the same pattern as some of the older SAAB sedans but am not too sure. We are eager to get some Porterfield pads for race use but want to make sure we order the correct ones. I realize we can give them tracings and have them custom made but I imagine that would be a bit pricier. Anyone recognize this pad pattern (that is a 1 1/2" bolt for reference)?
