garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

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Ol'fogasaurus
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garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:27 pm

http://www.kmart.com/performance-tool-c ... SKIP_LEVEL

I saw this on the "Black Friday" sale ads from Kmart. I really like the idea of it but the price is up there compared to the adjustable height stool I now use (20. Actually I have three sitting stools w/wheels (http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsea ... lt?q=stool mine is a different brand but basically the same stool) with one being a step-stool and the other one being a Harley saddle type that I don't use when welding or grinding) which, as soon as I sit on it at the upper most setting (19 1/2" off the floor) the seat drops down several inches.

Right now I am playing with the idea of building my own "creeper" as I have a three drawer tool box w/opening lid that I could use as it isn't really being used other than for some stored things that could be moved or gotten rid of (I need to clean house and that is for sure). The box closed measures 12" high, 20 1/2 wide and 9 1/2" deep (http://www.sears.com/craftsman-3-drawer ... ?rrec=true it is on sale now for $40).

As I said, my current stool seat, at max rise is 19 1/2"; the Sear's tool box sits at 12" which gives me about 6 1/2 inches to play with. Going with a caster like this: http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-x-3 ... 90997.html has a total height of 5" (I'm not sure that is to the top of the stud or to the landing. The wheel assy is good for 100#s so at 4 corners it's 400#s and I am not that heavy... yet!) which adding the frame work and seat pad could end up giving me a sitting height of about 5 1/2" to 7" or more/less depending on the caster's mounting height and just how I tackle this design.

Right now I don't have any scrap laying around that will work for this but a guesstimate for the frame would be in the $20 range, give or take, and the wheels would be ~$20. Upholstery would amount to the material, foam and plywood and if the seat sits on the frame or is hinged to tip the seat up to access the upper part of the tool box (will have to accommodate the lid of the box tilting up to access the tray. I could remove the lid and drawer locking mechanism but right now I don't think so).

If anyone is interested I can post on this otherwise, when and if I ever get it done I will post pictures.

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Piledriver
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Piledriver » Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:25 am

Neat.

Walmart has the WEN version of that PT creeper at the top link for $58 with free shipping.

I might have to pour some concrete.
Right now I would need big rubber pneumatic tires to run over gravel.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:15 am

Thanks Pile.

Back home now cleaning up damage from the big winter storm winds that came in while we were in AZ. I lost several sections fence last year and the year before but this year it was the long gate half for the MH to sit behind (ass'n. rules) so this time it will be a pipe gate not a 12 X 12 post on one end that rots out because the concrete was not done right :roll: . The guy did a nice fence (one of the builder's young guys who wanted to go into the fence building business) but forgot about sloping the concrete to drain away from the posts and not puddle.

Anyway, I have been thinking about this creeper the whole time I was outt'a here and I think I have some mods I want to make. The same tool box at Sears, when on sale, is `$60 so w/o (yet) looking at what Wally World has it might be a good deal and I could modify it to suit me. We were there yesterday but I did not go down to that end of the store... but I will for sure!

Where the two ends (wings) lay down I am thinking about putting magnetic trays in there. Put the small stuff in as you remove them and when you are not using the "wings" the mag trays could be used to hold them in a folded up position. Also, in the back get a magnetic strip to keep the tools off the deck (I come from a Navy town so I still speak Marine at times), out of the way and dry.

To be silly... you could also put a hitch on it to tow around a trailer for other things/parts :D (giggle).

Thanks again.

Lee

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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:39 pm

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Garage-Glide ... t/48705660

This is the Walmart unit. I went to my local Walmart and they did not have it nor knew anything about it.

I wanted to check some things like the gauge of material and how the tool box was located in the unit (does the tool box lid fold back after pulling up the seat pad for example).

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Dale M.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Dale M. » Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:09 pm

On line sale merchandise is about 500% more items than local stores... All the big box stores are that way most just drop ship...

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss ... Chest+Seat

Dale
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:55 pm

Thank Dale. When I stopped in at Wally World the guy there said to go on line to see if it was available, then I could buy it on line and have it shipped to the store for pickup. The guy was also impressed (curious?) when I described it to him.

Mostly I was hoping to see the construction and materials before I made the decision of buy or make. If I make one then two more will have to be done for family... maybe!

I really do like the ideas and basic designs of it as constant getting up and down to get stuff all the time or having to pick stuff up off the floor all the time sure gets tiring now days.

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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Piledriver » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:26 pm

Te PT unit is sold by oriellys and many others
The WEN unit Home depot etc
They are probably same other than paint/labels, by the same lady in China.

Walmart will deliver to your house for that price lately, not just a store like before.
Walmarts recently decided to push online sales/home delivery seriously trying to gain on Amazon.
I wish them luck.. They might beat Amazon on price, Amazons prices are frequently 2X normal retail.

I find Amazon a great place to shop but I rarely buy anything there as the price is usually out there.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:14 pm

Whoof!

I live reasonably close to a Home Despot (no insult intended HD)...I wonder....

I still want to see before I jump and all that is included. Probably more fun to build though and the trailer too 😁.

Cleaned up a single letter typo (closet/close) that the auto edit portion of my tablet added then refused to let me undo.
Last edited by Ol'fogasaurus on Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Piledriver » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:32 pm

It may be available online only, call ahead unless you need something else of course...

Home Depots website is pretty good about their inventory in stores showing up online as available in-store or not, they have a filter for that, and easy returns.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:27 pm

Well, I started building it. I never did get to look at one in person but since I had an old tool box with drawers and lid (I actually have 2 of them and they are probably older than some of the guys on the forum :roll: ) I decided to see if I could make one which allowed me to use up some scrap metal sitting around. It turned out I didn't have that much so today I had to go to the salvage yard and get some more.
IMG_0805 (2).JPG
This is where I am now. The bottom of the base is 1" X 0.095 square tube. I had enough scrap for one long piece and the two side pieces. I got several lengths of 1" X 1/8th" leg angle iron; I wanted thinner but they didn't have any. It turned out to be OK as when setting things together for the picture I found I would have to change things a bit.

There will be a lip along the top for the seat to nest into but sit high enough to clear the handle. That was the first mistake not allowing enough on the side pieces to cover the handle folded down but that also gave me so room to make some changes to the seat to allow room for the handle.

The wheels are HF units. 3" dia. wheels with a 200# capacity at each wheel (no... I am not that fat! :oops: ). They were the cheapest wheel I could get with a diameter that would allow the seat to cross the seams in the floor of my garage without hanging up. The square pieces are the feet of the casters that will be welded to the frame.
IMG_0805 (2).JPG
As you can see, I do have a second tool box like this so the box will now be put too good use where is was just sitting, taking up room before.

It is funny how setting up the pictures got me looking at things a bit differently. I can picture and rotate things in my mind (I have done so many layout and installation drawings that it somewhat comes naturally now) but the seeing the whole picture sometimes brings out the little stuff that the big stuff can crowd out. The eye of the center lock piece will most likely have to be removed... I missed that in the planning stage.
IMG_0805 (2).JPG
As you can see, this is an older tool box and it has an open chamber in the top allowing for more storage which I am not sure that the commercial units have. Lift the seat off and wha-la. One thing I had over thought was that the lid only raises 90°; for some reason I had it in my mind that it laid flat which easies the build some.

Anyway, if you don't mind: this is a just-for-the-heck-of-it build.

Lee

I still don't understand why the triple (this time) pix and the last one being out of line when I use the "attachments" part.

I forgot to add, the top of the seat will be in the 17" to 19" range depending on what I do for the seat pad. Casters are 3 1/2"s, the main frame is 1", the tool box is 12" and fitting the handle in will be part of the seat build.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Piledriver » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:17 pm

Could you attach the cushion to the lid and have them "open" together?
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:28 am

Pile, I had thought of that but the handle would be very uncomfortable! :D I guess I could remove it but the idea was to leave it there and be able to pull the box out if or when needed. Tool box removal may not ever be necessary but then replacement sometime might be... you never know. It is an option that I will think about again... thank you for bringing the idea up again.

I just went out and took a look and measured the laydown height of the handle and it is roughly an inch high. I was going to either raise the top parameter angle up on the verticals to accommodate the seat and/or to build the seat's base with a relief to accommodate the handle.

The handle has 4 small rivets that would require a drill to take the rolled part of the rivet away so the handle could be removed. Other than lowering the seat height an inch (depending) it wouldn't make building the box any easier to build but the attached seat would be easier to keep track of than a removable seat might be during the heat of the battle. I am not far enough along that it could be easily done especially because of length I cut the verticals (I forgot to add the inch height to cover the handle in the first place... I already had a fix for that so no problem)... more thought needed.

Again, I haven't seem the on-line seats so I am not sure what their design is doing. Because of what their tool box pictures show, I don't think they have an opening lid; if so, top access could be that it isn't a problem and the seat could be more permanently attached.

When I was up at the salvage yard waiting for my turn to have my order filled I got talking to another pensioner who lived out in the sticks but since the population growth around here has gotten out of control he has felt that he needed to add bars on the windows (and doors?) as a necessity. While we were gabbing I showed him what I was trying to build and he did a double take and got very excited and started asking a whole lot of questions. About then was when my order was filled and I headed home to beat the rain (yeah... right! It was an off and on cloud burst the whole 15 or so miles to home)

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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:43 pm

For what it is worth, this is the rivets that hold the handle on that I was talking about.
IMG_0809.JPG
I was thinking about the mounting of the seat to the lid and trying to remember why I didn't do it when I almost burned my breakfast. I gotta stop doing that or I might starve to death.

Anyway, I did remember why and it has to do with the lid and it's landing at the top of the box which I don't think are strong enough to take sustained abuse. All four of the corners are not joined at the relief but the upper ends of the joggle have a bend that is a roll-over giving some strength to the material. The back hinge area is a continuous "piano hinge" which, in itself, does strengthen up the back of the box/lid but does not continue in to help the landing gain any strength from it.
IMG_0808.JPG
FWIW (and I am sure you already know this Dusty but for others who don't): On another string I was talking about bending metal and the need for a "radius relief" and material relief on corners. The picture below shows both being done but not being finished because they didn't plan on the abuse my large fanny could apply especially over time.

A relief is added when two different bends join: Two ways to do it as I remember one being costly and difficult and the other being a bit more easily done. When bending metal, flat stock or formed as it a round tube the material on the inside of the radius compresses during the bend. Too tight of a bend for the thickness and grade of the material and the material will either collapse into a tight fold or do something like a "Pittsburg Lock (https://www.bing.com/images/search?view ... ajaxhist=0). The outside of the material will want/need to stretch and pull in. When you see the bend start to "grey" what you are seeing is the surface of the material start to tear (stress cracks). To view this (somewhat) take an ordinary soda straw and put both thumbs together on it then start to bend the material. The material of the straw is stiffer than metal so it will do it's thing faster but it will give you and idea of what is going on.

The first and most expensive and difficult way to solve the intersection of the bends is to do a "spherical radius" (more obvious when joining three radiuses such as when vacuum forming something like a box) which requires special tooling to enjoin the two radiuses but forming another radius which also stretches and compresses the material. when forming a three wall spherical radius "tear out of the wall of the radius" becomes very common.

The other, cheaper, way to solve the problem is to make a radius relief cut as shown in the picture. A minimum radius relief would extend past the radius OMLs (an ML [mold line] is the spot where the straight material and the radius of the bend join. A bend has an inside ML, aka IML and the outside has a ML called a outside ML [OML]). Add to this the edges of the bend as to be relieved a bit so when the two bends join the materials will not want to fight for the space or overlap so the relief is added there too.
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Dale M.
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Dale M. » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:36 am

I think you will rip top off tool box or rip handle off top of tool box with that handle if you try to lift it when full of tools.... Better to remove it and put padded seat on top of box and add two handles one on each end of tool box.... Also weight of you body may squash down lid on lip of box body and distort lid in way it gets bent to where it will never close properly and be supportive as a good seat.... May have to design a set of retainers on front of box so lid stays where intended... Dont think meager little guides on latches are robust enough to keep lid in proper place...

Dale
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Re: garage sitting creaper with tool box built in

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:56 am

Hi Dale, long time no talk.

I have several large tool boxes to store things in... which I do. They are also usually use specific; e.g., air tools, electrical, lathe/milling machine, hand tools, etc..

It is more of a lazy way of storing all the tools and parts you need for a current project without tools and parts laying on the floor getting in the way or kicked around out of reach. It also allows the smaller parts or easily damaged parts to be stored with some protection or having to continuously get up and down to get them as you need them.

I am trying to make the wings so they can be folded up but when down those magnetic trays can be used to store nuts, bolts and reused small parts in as you remove them and not get damaged or lost.

"I think you will rip top off tool box or rip handle off top of tool box with that handle if you try to lift it when full of tools.... Better to remove it and put padded seat on top of box and add two handles one on each end of tool box.... Also weight of you body may squash down lid on lip of box body and distort lid in way it gets bent to where it will never close properly and be supportive as a good seat.... May have to design a set of retainers on front of box so lid stays where intended... Dont think meager little guides on latches are robust enough to keep lid in proper place..."

That is pretty much what I was (trying to anyway) saying I would do Dale. Like most portable tool boxes, this box was intended as a fairly light weight unit, maybe someone's' first tool box, with shallow depth drawers so it isn't a big time strong in many ways. The lid and landing were not designed to be used as a seat, foot stool or even strong enough for storage on top of it. The box is bent up/formed light (gauge) weight steel which is why the frame. I wanted to go with something less than 1/8" angle iron but where (a salvage yard) I got the material does not carry anything less than what I ended up with.

The side handles won't work due to the side pieces (not shown in the pictures yet) of the landing for the seat which is going to be at least three sided with (maybe) the forth side a bit lower to allow the lid to open or the landing might need to be raised... not sure yet.

Due to allergy season being so late and hard this year I am not able to spend a lot of time in the garage as it is dangerous to be continuously sneezing and blowing while operating tools or runny eyes trying to focus on measurements :oops: .

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