107mm Nickies! Pushing the MAX!

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Wally
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Post by Wally » Fri Jul 28, 2006 10:36 am

MASSIVE TYPE IV wrote:
This one is most definately going twin spark.
But weren't the Engine Plus heads you have, single spark? Oh wait, you (euh, Len probably) will machine them in of course :lol:
T4T: Type 4 Turbo engine, under construction

MASSIVE TYPE IV
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Post by MASSIVE TYPE IV » Fri Jul 28, 2006 10:57 am

Yes, they are singles.. Len is doing some measurements to see if his current fixture will index the plug where it needs to be correctly in the engine Plus heads...

If not, we'll just get a new set more than likely. wally, do you know anyone there, do you think they might be willing to sell us a bare set with only some basic machining done?

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Wally
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Post by Wally » Fri Jul 28, 2006 11:09 am

Yes, I've spoken to the owner of Engine Plus a few times. He is Jan Lackstätter. He is the original designer of both 'types' of the type 4-type 1 heads :wink:
He is very keen to get feed back from dealers for inprovements sake, not to mention that you can get a nice discount when you are a dealer (I declined politely, as I am not a shop, dealer or anything :wink: ), so getting a bare set for an 'experiment' would probably be welcomed.
I think you would 'qualify' as a dealer if your even bought one (bare) set from him :lol:
Nor sure how his english is as we always spoke in german..but you probably be ok in english as part of his site is in english as well:


http://www.engineplus.de/pages/eng/engnavi.html

Good luck!
T4T: Type 4 Turbo engine, under construction

MASSIVE TYPE IV
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Post by MASSIVE TYPE IV » Fri Jul 28, 2006 11:43 am

Thanks for the info...

I was always under the impression that Jan was an outside finisher of the heads, I didn't know that he was "The" man..

I will contact him via email and see what he says. with this engine we are going to have so much time in everything else that I'd like to just bolt some heads on and go with it instead of having to go through all the challenges related....

Bare castings may or may not be the way to go...

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914fan
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Post by 914fan » Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:20 pm

Jake,
Perhaps I missed something, but why are you not going to use your billet heads on this one? Do the head plus heads flow more? I thought your flowed the most.

MASSIVE TYPE IV
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Post by MASSIVE TYPE IV » Fri Jul 28, 2006 2:25 pm

Its a matter of providing the customer with something thats fully developed..

The big head project here can only be worked on when we have extra time, and there isn't much of that and probably won't be.

As I stated, only time will tell what we end up doing.. we have 14 months more before the engine is due, so there is plenty of time to make the most wise decision.

There is even a possibility (good one) that Len and I might try something along the lines of the LE 230 twin plug head similar to that of the Mighty Spyder.. If the customer was in a hotter climate where cooling capability was most important we would definately go this route, but in Hawaii its damn near perfect year round....

Yet again, the roller cam changes everything as well....

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Can Drive Soon
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Re: 107mm Nickies! Pushing the MAX!

Post by Can Drive Soon » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:09 pm

MASSIVE TYPE IV wrote:
A few weeks ago I had a customer request the "biggest engine we would build"....
I couldn't imagine how much Jake was tickled pink when he got that request! :D


So 107mm cyls, big, biggest RAT has worked with, but what is the max? 110, 115, 120mm??!!

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Unkl Ian
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Post by Unkl Ian » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:49 pm

The "max" depends on the bolt pattern,and bore centerlines.
I think Jake said this was the max for the stock pattern.

70dragbug
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Post by 70dragbug » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:59 am

Jake, IIRC Jan Lackstetter does excellent casting work aswell.Maybe worth looking into for your heads.

subimanx
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Post by subimanx » Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:26 am

Very interesting to say the least!! Will be watching the progress eagerly!!!

Passatman
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Post by Passatman » Sun Jul 30, 2006 8:07 am

Jake what has happened to your type1 styled heads. Have you stopped development of these.

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Post by MASSIVE TYPE IV » Sun Jul 30, 2006 5:26 pm

Passatman wrote:Jake what has happened to your type1 styled heads. Have you stopped development of these.
No, they are still in the works, but I don't see them being "finished" enough for anything less than a prototype engine for at least another 2 years. The amount of time this program demands can't be taken head on while so many things are going on that we can't do it all.

With the cost these heads will have, about 3-4 engines per year would have the budget to utilize them and I don't ever seeing us selling them without a full engine of "Super Hero" stature using them...
Jake, IIRC Jan Lackstetter does excellent casting work aswell.Maybe worth looking into for your heads
We want to keep our heads billet, due to the verastility of modifications and so we can change every pair of heads to compliment the engine they are to be fitted to. With a casting, the molds are expensive to make and seriously limit what can be done to the base unit after being cast. This is not true with billet, a good for instance is cooling fins... Fins are the most expensive part of the billet head, so engines that are for drag or autocross applications could have the fins removed by a significant number and reduce the cost of the heads. By the same token more fins could also be added for other applications..
The "max" depends on the bolt pattern,and bore centerlines.
I think Jake said this was the max for the stock pattern.
This is actually above the max for most people to accomplish. Even at 107mm we are having to do a lot of one off things to the case, head studs and cylinders to allow it to happen(welding of the registers to aid in cylinder sealing and to increase the strength of this area with so much material from the ID removed). Typically 106.3mm is the MAX for a normal person to accomplish.

"Project X" uses a 111.5mm bore size with a completely different stud pattern and lots of machine work to make it happen. 111.5mm is the largest that can be done with the TIV- thats why I have been working on this engine since 2001.

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Can Drive Soon
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Post by Can Drive Soon » Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:29 pm

I can see it now, Project X has its own little corner to hide while other engines are being assembled. It will be Jake own little sick, twisted awesome monster creation..

MASSIVE TYPE IV
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Post by MASSIVE TYPE IV » Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:38 pm

Project X has only been seen by 3 people, two of which are employees...

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Tingly Bill
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Post by Tingly Bill » Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:53 pm

I saw it once

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