RIP WBX

Here's the place for info on converting to a Type V motor!
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Stripped66
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Stripped66 » Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:31 am

turner wrote: i heard from several engines with broken rods on the 3rd Zylinder.
Must be a common problem on wbxer :twisted:
Often the lubrications is broken down.
It's the location of the stock oil pick-up. The pick-up is in the middle of the sump and not near the bottom of the sump. The pick-up looses suction under hard acceleration, climbing, and high-g turns. If your oil pressure gauge didn't show you loosing pressure then the gauge/sender is not responsive enough.

You need to relocate your pick-up to the back/bottom of the case or dry-sump the engine.

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fastback
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by fastback » Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:50 am

cry once and drysump it.
since the wbx also is picky on the fit of the oilpump.
aftermarket pumps tend to be to loose fit .
Torsten Pieper has the pump for you.
or at least o-ring the oilpump

turner
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Location: Germany

Re: RIP WBX

Post by turner » Sat Aug 24, 2013 1:08 pm

My new (used) crankshaft comes from Torsten, the pump will be fitted with vitone rings.
The relocating of the pick-up is a good idea.

Turner

Passatman
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Passatman » Sat Aug 24, 2013 2:06 pm

I have been hearing about this guy for a long while do you have a website for him.

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Piledriver
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Piledriver » Sat Aug 24, 2013 4:42 pm

He does tool steel lifters/inserts as well...

A set of teflon pin buttons look like the ticket, if your pistons are compatible.
(won't work well with slipper skirts)

The usual ones fo T1 won't fit, but 1" teflon rod is ~cheap.

Tencentlife had a great thread on WBX oiling mods, although it was using a mostly the stock pickup, it has much info that would still be valid on a dry sump setup.

Also a good time re redirect the output of the pressure relief back to the dry sump tank rather than the sump.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

Phil69
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Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:24 am

Re: RIP WBX

Post by Phil69 » Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:15 pm

No need to relocate the pick up just run with 1liter more oil than maximum on dipstick.

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Piledriver
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Piledriver » Sat Sep 21, 2013 7:46 pm

Phil69 wrote:No need to relocate the pick up just run with 1liter more oil than maximum on dipstick.
...most of the mods of interest had to do with how the relief bypass oil gets returned to the sump...
(it doesn't on the factory setup or on late T4s. This can be fixed)
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

helowrench
Posts: 1923
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 8:20 am
Location: East of Dallas TX

Re: RIP WBX

Post by helowrench » Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:59 pm

Looking at the valve spring retainers.
#1 Are those off the shelf items, or was the drilling done for lightening purposes?
#2 what weight savings did you achieve?
#3 Did you expect the drilled holes to effect longevity

turner
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Location: Germany

Re: RIP WBX

Post by turner » Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:44 pm

Sorry,i have a Compi breakdown.
1.The valve spring retainers are hand made from my best friend Jürgen
2.No idea,at this moment they are on the way to the new valves,43x37
3.Long,Jürgen do this a long time at his engines.
Last week the case is send to engineplus for the big bore :D
Now i must look for the head gaskets,because the liners are bigger at the top end.They are thicker than the Öttis 8)
Target are 180hp,i hope so :roll:
Now i must first fixed my 1776ccm typ3 engine ,the screw at the fan/crankshaft losen up after 28000km.
500km from home we fixed it on the campingplace and could drive home :D

cheers turner

helowrench wrote:Looking at the valve spring retainers.
#1 Are those off the shelf items, or was the drilling done for lightening purposes?
#2 what weight savings did you achieve?
#3 Did you expect the drilled holes to effect longevity

Jürgen N.
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:01 pm

Re: RIP WBX

Post by Jürgen N. » Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:08 pm

helowrench wrote:Looking at the valve spring retainers.
#1 Are those off the shelf items, or was the drilling done for lightening purposes?
#2 what weight savings did you achieve?
#3 Did you expect the drilled holes to effect longevity
Hi,

I think drilling made 6-7 grams per retainer. The stock WBX ones are needless heavy.
I made it on a milling machine.
For several years some engines run with stock retainers drilled ( typ1 / typ4 and this WBX ) - I never lost a retainer.
I don`t believe, that you have some risk of breaking.
For heavy double springs it could happen, that the retainer shims are slippnig through...
Normally I try to use light springs.
All my own cams are designed for light springs.

BR Jürgen N.

Jürgen N.
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:01 pm

Re: RIP WBX

Post by Jürgen N. » Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:39 pm

Some more notes to the engine and new ideas:

The old one was representive for modified stock parts.
Only carbs, exhaust, cam and lifters were changed - the rest was modified stock.
The cam was a 332 degrees with 12,0mm at the cam ( no 328 degrees ).
With only 9,9:1 compression ratio the engine was very agressive beginning with 4.500 min up to 7.500 min with stock WBX double springs but had little less torque at low rpms.

For the new engine I think we should try a further developed cam, let`s see.
Maybe with asymmetric valve timing ( 328 - 330 degrees timing ).
I tried this at two of Torsten Pieper own LBX-engines sucessfully.
And the compression ratio will be increasing...not less then 10,8:1...
For the valves I haven`t finished my ideas.
Maybe 43 / 37 with 7mm shaft ( Mercedes ) or 44 / 38 with 8mm shaft ( Schrick billet ).
Good suggestions are welcome :D .

My very good friend Stefan bought some NOS 98mm Oettinger pistons in Ebay USA.
After receiving we noticed, that somebody milled the combustion skip of the pistons.
Now we only have 3,0mm piston dome thickness.
7.500 min and 11,0:1 compression ratio - what`s your opinion on this object?

BR Jürgen

Passatman
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Passatman » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:35 pm

jurgen are these mercedes valves readily available, also are they stock waterboxer length. I like the idea of a 7mm stem, more flow around the valve.

Can you give me the part number for the mercedes valves.

Passatman
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Re: RIP WBX

Post by Passatman » Tue Nov 05, 2013 7:38 pm

Are bmw m20 valves another option here.

Jürgen N.
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:01 pm

Re: RIP WBX

Post by Jürgen N. » Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:27 pm

The length isn`t exactly the same comparing to the WBX.
But you are able to shorten it.
I have to look for the number.

Not only the flow, the more less weight is interesting...

BR Jürgen

Jürgen N.
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:01 pm

Re: RIP WBX

Post by Jürgen N. » Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:28 pm

Passatman wrote:Are bmw m20 valves another option here.
I`ll check this out.

BR Jürgen

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