Replacement camshaft for WBX?

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tmatre
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Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by tmatre » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:36 pm

I am looking for a replacement camshaft for WBX, but can not find anything but reground (vw heritage)
Do you know of anyone selling new DJ camshafts? I bet they are expensive...

Other alternatives for hydraulic lifters?
Anyone using the CB performance 2251 hydraulic cam in WBX?
How do this perform in a camper compared to the stock DJ camshaft?

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fastback
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by fastback » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:49 pm

2252 should be ~ to the stock DJ.

or they have 2253 and 2254.
tencentlife has some more info on using these.

AMBROSIA
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by AMBROSIA » Thu Sep 30, 2010 10:28 am

I'm using the 2252 in my DJ engine.
Pulls like a train, nice bit of kit.
Shame you have all the extra import costs :evil:

buildabiggerboxer
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by buildabiggerboxer » Thu Sep 30, 2010 11:32 am

D.J camshaft. I have these new, genuine v.w german manufacture. also cam followers.

tmatre
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by tmatre » Sat Oct 02, 2010 4:37 pm

I have found some new posts...
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=122471&hilit=cooler&start=15
2280 may also be used with hydraulic lifters, more lift...
tencentlife:
2.2 litre wbcx.. 94hp @ 4550, 130ft.lb. @3250. Rear Wheels
Torque abowe 120 (162NM) from 2.4K to 4K

2251 Duration 266° / Dur. @ .050" 210° / Lift @ cam .276" / Lift w/1.1:1 Rocker Arms .303"
2252 Duration 270° / Dur. @ .050" 214° / Lift @ cam .298" / Lift w/1.1:1 Rocker Arms .327"
2254 Duration 308° / Dur. @ .050" 236° / Lift @ cam .319" / Lift w/1.1:1 Rocker Arms .350"

2280 Duration 274° / Dur. @ .050" 222° / Lift @ cam .359" / Lift w/1.1:1 Rocker Arms .394"

I think I will go fo the 2280 :-)

tencentlife
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by tencentlife » Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:03 am

I think I will go fo the 2280 :-)
Of the few cams I have tried in these 2.2's that's the one I would suggest first, it is overall the torque monster. If you use stock double valve springs and 1.1 rockers, you'll want to shim the springs up .060" to avoid any valve float as it goes over 5k rpm. 1.1's put the valve lift right around .400" which in my experience is the sweet spot with these heads as stock, that's where the intake works best for torque. I've increased the intake lift over that amount and it kills the low-range torque. I used 1.25's for awhile but wouldn't even think of using ratios on the 2280 anymore, the ramps are just too aggro on this cam, but that's that fast lift that makes the torque.

I've run the 2252 in several engines, it is closest to stock performance of the ones named here so far, tighter LCA so idle isn't as smooth but the low range is good, it holds good mid-range torque too for highway hillclimbing. But once I tried the 2280 I have used it in most of my engines since then (about ten have it, including my daily which has about 30k on this cam and I just had the lifters out, things look good).

I also used the 2254 for about a year, it would be a great cam if you had a different FI that would allow revving to 6500, but it's just coming into its own with the stock FI when the fuel cut hits at ~5400, although if you keep the intake lift low it also has pretty amazing off-idle torque, kind of odd, it shouldn't, but it does.

I've found the hydro lifters will run on a lot of solid-grind cams as long as you spec them out visually first for edge interference. I've seen zero troubles so far, if anything they work better. Of course your oiling system needs to be tip-top for good hydro operation, the best thing to do is have external oil cooling to cap temps at 230F and run a light baseweight oil, like 5wXX.

Trying out a couple new cams lately and will probably be adding some data to the cam data thread sometime soon. I just build Vanagon engines so I'm in search of smooth performance with lots of low-mid range torque, so my impressions might not be that helpful for people building race or sandbuggy engines or whatever else.

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WBX Man
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by WBX Man » Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:12 am

Did anyboby try the 2236 ?

2236 Eagle Racing Cam - Adv. Duration 280° / Dur. @ .050" 236° / Lift @ cam .339" / Lift w/1.1:1 Rocker Arms .372"

I still have one I would like to try... :P

fikmyk
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by fikmyk » Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:05 pm

Looking for advice... my T3 DJ has broken camshaft, I'm looking for replacement as stock is not available and all used one that I found are in bad condition. I want more less stock performance without any changes in lifters, SCAT, adjusters. I travel mostly 50-75 MPH on motorways and I have Vanagon Joker 2.1 DJ bit heavier that normal one (pop-up roof). Can you advice which camshaft would be best? I was thinking about CB 2280 or CB 2252...

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Piledriver
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by Piledriver » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:28 pm

From memory a Webcam 86 is roughly equivalent to a late MV cam, don't know that the DJs had.

Given press in T1 lifter bushings can be had cheap these days, there should be a lot more good choices.
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AMBROSIA
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by AMBROSIA » Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:37 am

If you're uk based a company called 'The Engine Shop' sells newly made camshafts suitable as replacements.
http://www.theengineshop.info/acatalog/ ... 9TES1.html
Jim sells several variations including performance so perhaps give him a call to discuss what you need.
They are uk made iirc.
I was originally going with one of his fast road cam's:
Duration 290 degrees
Lift @ cam .289

In the end i wanted more hp so went the bush insert route and solids.

jackstraw
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by jackstraw » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:03 pm

Quick question. So are the 2.1 Vanagon hydraulic lifters the ones used if running any of the three cams listed above.?

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Piledriver
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by Piledriver » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:23 pm

You could at the higher cost and lower reliability the hydros bring.

The "correct" drop in lifter would be a solid lifter for a T4.
That will require different pushrods.

Ideally the lifter bore would get a radial groove to allow oil flow around the lifter as the hydro lifter does.
If I had a used set of hydros, I would have them reground and then shim them for zero travel, use as solids.
(The WBX case needs all the HVX oiling mods just like a T1, they didn't use anything they learned from the T4)

Either the solids or hydros have the same adjustment interval, so the hydros primary flaw is hiding the warning in the event something starts to go south in the valvetrain.

They have no upside AFAIK, other than being potentially a little quieter... although when they suck some air (and they eventually will) you will be certain there's a broken rod slinging around inside the case until it clears out.

I strongly suggest sending any lifters to SLR for regrind to correct radii and parkerized.
(new or used if you have them)
Last edited by Piledriver on Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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jackstraw
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by jackstraw » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:34 pm

Duly noted. To expand on this without drifting too far off topic, your second statement has me think that the solid T4 lifter is the same length and diameter as the Wasser hydraulic and thus the same as the T4 hydraulic, which may be one in the same. (?)
The albeit to this would be to obtain or make proper push rods.

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Piledriver
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by Piledriver » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:42 pm

The late T4s used the same hydraulic lifters, AFAIK they are interchangeable, but to be honest I have never installed a set, just replaced with solids... I suppose the cup height might differ but I doubt it. Hydros do take shorter pushrods than the solids.

Note that you can run hydraulic lifters on a "solid lifter" cam, at a slight loss in duration.
(Most hydro cams are really solid lifter cams that happen to work OK with hydros)

A true hydraulic lifter cam has a short violent ramp to seat the check valve ball on each lift.
...putting solid lifters on a true hydraulic lifter cam will break something quickly.

A web 86 is pretty close to a stock MV cam.
I had the stock cam reground to be a Web86/1600DP combo (Atkinson or Miller cycle)
Never got around to finishing that one, my give a damn got damaged when the 914 got run over.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

jackstraw
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Re: Replacement camshaft for WBX?

Post by jackstraw » Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:00 pm

Cool. Thanks. Backstory. I'm an old Am iron motorhead from way back. Parts is parts and they are all interchangeable within its respective family.
Enter the past decade of VW's and I'm finding lots of little tidbits all across the board of interchange info due to a gentle morphing from one phase to another. Parts is parts also but different world than what I'm used to. Thanx again

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