1600 EFI Turbo Build
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
1600 EFI Turbo Build
Alright. I have been working on my 1600DP for a couple months now. And I am to the point where it's just about ready for the turbo.
Here is the thread of what has been done so far http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 6&t=141598
But to get up to speed here is what I am starting with
Right now it had a pretty solid tune in it. I took it to the Dyno and did some base line runs before I go turbo and here is where I'm at
87.5tq 59hp
Quick video and one of the pulls
Now, I want to develop a turbo kit as an add on for for my EFI packages. I have been working with Shag55 to get a turbo that is appropriate.
What seems like a good fit is a T3 .36 a/r turbine with a 50 trim compressor. This should get the little guy spooled quick and be pretty efficient on the cold side of things while leaving some headroom for a larger displacement motor as well.
I'm still trying to decide if it's worth the effort to build a header in 1 3/8" to get the best performance or just go with a more standard 1 1/2" for ease. Another decision still up in the air is to go internal or external wastegate. It is almost a wash in price just because of the extra time involved with making a internal wastegate fit under the confines of an apron and have the turbo positioned correctly. Unfortunately I don't have the funds available to get both.
So there it is. I am open to suggestions from everyone to make this a worthwhile venture that suits more than one application
Here is the thread of what has been done so far http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 6&t=141598
But to get up to speed here is what I am starting with
Right now it had a pretty solid tune in it. I took it to the Dyno and did some base line runs before I go turbo and here is where I'm at
87.5tq 59hp
Quick video and one of the pulls
Now, I want to develop a turbo kit as an add on for for my EFI packages. I have been working with Shag55 to get a turbo that is appropriate.
What seems like a good fit is a T3 .36 a/r turbine with a 50 trim compressor. This should get the little guy spooled quick and be pretty efficient on the cold side of things while leaving some headroom for a larger displacement motor as well.
I'm still trying to decide if it's worth the effort to build a header in 1 3/8" to get the best performance or just go with a more standard 1 1/2" for ease. Another decision still up in the air is to go internal or external wastegate. It is almost a wash in price just because of the extra time involved with making a internal wastegate fit under the confines of an apron and have the turbo positioned correctly. Unfortunately I don't have the funds available to get both.
So there it is. I am open to suggestions from everyone to make this a worthwhile venture that suits more than one application
Last edited by MarioVelotta on Wed Jan 20, 2016 9:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
The Dub Shop
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1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
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1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
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- Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:04 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
You are right Mario. The 1 3/8 would be ideal but getting a decent collector is difficult. I'd go external gate to leave options open and for easily adjusted.
------------------------------------
Shag Leone, SL-1 Racing
325WHP and 290TQ @17# on 91oct
383WHP and 324TQ @23psi on 50/50 mix
What's next?
Need a turbo or parts!
[email protected]
Facebook at SL 1 racing
Shag Leone, SL-1 Racing
325WHP and 290TQ @17# on 91oct
383WHP and 324TQ @23psi on 50/50 mix
What's next?
Need a turbo or parts!
[email protected]
Facebook at SL 1 racing
- T-34
- Posts: 93
- Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:44 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Are you developing a kit for sale or only for your car?
I had to think quite hard about how far to go with my supercharger kit. Too expensive and people might just opt to build a bigger motor - I figured that there is only so much money people will invest on a stock 1600. I decided that for my kit is had to be affordable and also much cheaper than increasing the capacity. I would recommend setting the budget before you start.
If cost is no option - Go with the external gate. It will give you more options for tuning. Internal is obviously better on the pocket.
Either way I personally would go with the 1 3/8 headers. Chances are that you will be better off getting the headers made up - If you are supplying a kit it will be cheaper to get your own headers manufactured than it would to buy in generic ones and then sell them on. The Dyno figures will help to sell your kit - there are other 1600 kits out there - might as well give yours the edge by taking every advantage you can.
Looking forward to seeing how this develops.
Mick.
I had to think quite hard about how far to go with my supercharger kit. Too expensive and people might just opt to build a bigger motor - I figured that there is only so much money people will invest on a stock 1600. I decided that for my kit is had to be affordable and also much cheaper than increasing the capacity. I would recommend setting the budget before you start.
If cost is no option - Go with the external gate. It will give you more options for tuning. Internal is obviously better on the pocket.
Either way I personally would go with the 1 3/8 headers. Chances are that you will be better off getting the headers made up - If you are supplying a kit it will be cheaper to get your own headers manufactured than it would to buy in generic ones and then sell them on. The Dyno figures will help to sell your kit - there are other 1600 kits out there - might as well give yours the edge by taking every advantage you can.
Looking forward to seeing how this develops.
Mick.
http://vdubber.com - Aircooled blogs, builds and banter.
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Shag, I was able to find a collector. It's not a burns but should get the job done. I'm not sure of the output size but it will need to be formed anyway. Thoughts?
Mick, I would like to sell these along with my EFI packages. Cost is important but I also want it to work well. I know you can do a junkyard turbo build for $300 but that isn't an option here. I figure the add on is going to cost around $1500. Half of that being a reliable new turbo wastegate and blow-off. Then the Header, flanges, oil supply and drain, sump and intake pluming etc.
The header will be the toughest part but I don't have enough finds to pay for a bulk order. Shag or I will be making the initial header then a jig built up from the final design to be replicated.
Also all of the other "kits" I have seen put the turbo in the engine compartment, I don't dig it.
Mick, I would like to sell these along with my EFI packages. Cost is important but I also want it to work well. I know you can do a junkyard turbo build for $300 but that isn't an option here. I figure the add on is going to cost around $1500. Half of that being a reliable new turbo wastegate and blow-off. Then the Header, flanges, oil supply and drain, sump and intake pluming etc.
The header will be the toughest part but I don't have enough finds to pay for a bulk order. Shag or I will be making the initial header then a jig built up from the final design to be replicated.
Also all of the other "kits" I have seen put the turbo in the engine compartment, I don't dig it.
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
I ordered my turbo from Shag so that's a good step forward but I still have lots of parts to get
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
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- Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 9:28 pm
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
What did you order???
I'm curious to see what size it will be in comparison to what I run.
I'm curious to see what size it will be in comparison to what I run.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
T3 .36 a/r turbine with a 50 trim compressorClonebug wrote:What did you order???
I'm curious to see what size it will be in comparison to what I run.
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
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- Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 3:36 pm
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Factoid: that's the same turbo BMC used on the Metro turbo. Also, the ERA turbo Mini I think.
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
I thought the 1L motors had a .25 A/R
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
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- Posts: 3944
- Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 3:36 pm
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Oops, you're right. And it was a 40 trim compressor too. Either way, dinky little things.
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- Posts: 1245
- Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:04 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Dinky! Lol.
Shipping it today Mario
Shipping it today Mario
------------------------------------
Shag Leone, SL-1 Racing
325WHP and 290TQ @17# on 91oct
383WHP and 324TQ @23psi on 50/50 mix
What's next?
Need a turbo or parts!
[email protected]
Facebook at SL 1 racing
Shag Leone, SL-1 Racing
325WHP and 290TQ @17# on 91oct
383WHP and 324TQ @23psi on 50/50 mix
What's next?
Need a turbo or parts!
[email protected]
Facebook at SL 1 racing
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
My Turbo came today! Now to get the rest together. I hate waiting
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
-
- Posts: 4719
- Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 9:28 pm
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
What are the sizes of the compressor wheel inlet and the turbine outlet???
It looks pretty close to the same size I am running right now.
I'd be really interested at what rpm it gets to full boost or in my case 13 lbs.
It looks pretty close to the same size I am running right now.
I'd be really interested at what rpm it gets to full boost or in my case 13 lbs.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.
- MarioVelotta
- Posts: 4083
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:01 am
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
You started with a standard header. Was it 1.375 or 1.5"?
The Dub Shop
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
[email protected]
1600 ITB NA - 18sec
1600 Supercharged - 13psi - 15.40 @ 84.66mph
1600 Turbo - 185hp 250tq!! Going for 200
2276 Turbo - 15psi - 11.537 @ 115.74mph
Facebook-Tech-Store
-
- Posts: 4719
- Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 9:28 pm
Re: 1600 turbo EFI build
Are you talking to me???
It is a 1 1/2 inch header.....typical cheap sedan header with the really short collector.
It is a 1 1/2 inch header.....typical cheap sedan header with the really short collector.
Stripped66 wrote:The point wasn't to argue air temps with the current world record holder, but to dispel the claim that the K03 is wrapped up at 150 HP. It's not.