TMM 2332 FI Turbo Engine build thread

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:11 pm

I've started to build a new motor for the manx, figured we could use a thread as this forum has been kinda dead lately.

Engine will be a 84x94 built in a CB alum case.

So far I have the case:

It's been to RIMCO and had the center main cut for a type 4 bearing, cut for a sand seal, and all the galleys tapped.

Parts I have so far:
SCAT 5.5 H beam rods with 3/8 ARP 2K bolts, Clevite 77 VW rod journal bearings, Mahle main bearings, and misc parts to put the crank assy together.

I have the crank & FW on order at DPR, it's 84 stroke, type 4 center main, VW rod journals, 12lb flywheel wedgemated.

That's where I am today.

Motor is primarily for off road use and a little street. Everyone in my group went turbo Subaru, I still like VW and am gonna show them a bit of german HP. Don't bother telling me to go water pumper, I'm stubborn as a bull.

I don't care about dyno numbers, I'm shooting for major low end torque and violent power on boost. Haven't picked a cam or head combo yet, still thinking about it. Compression will be 8.25:1 or therabouts. Would love to hear suggestions. One friend is pushing Tim's stage 2+, the 120 with 1.25's, I was thinking an 86B on 112LC and CB oval ports.

What I'm hung up on now is the induction system. I am using the CB FI end castings now, but don't like the sharp airflow transition into the heads, was thinking about some IDF type manifolds and a small plenum like Marty makes hooked to a single throttle body. Would appreciate comments on this too.

C-YA in the dirt

ToRy 70 · Post by **ToRy 70** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 3:32 pm

What turbo? I say do the induction however you want, you have all the room you need! IDF manifolds, plenums, and a single TB is exactly the way i'd do it too. Are your lifter bores sleeved?

Humpty · Post by **Humpty** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 7:21 pm

What Tory said.... Bring it on TMM....

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 8:10 pm

Lifter bores are not sleeved, that's to fix a weakness with a mag case when using a radical cam, alum cases don't need this.

Turbo will be optimized for whatever combo I end up with, and suitable for up to 20 psi on race fuel. I'll buy a brand new one, I want to experience what todays technology has to offer. After I get the cam/heads combo sorted out, along with the induction system then I'll order a new turbo.

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:31 pm

More parts arrived today.

DPR crank - 84 stroke, VW journals, type 4 center main, balanced together.

12lb wedgemated flywheel

Just add .038" of shims to get .006" end play, very nice.

If your wondering how much bigger a type 4 main is than a standard main journal, take a look. .200"

You can't tell from the pictures, but the wedgemate is spectacular and the rod journal radius is also very nice. It seems to measure perfect on the journals and mains, but I just checked quick with a caliper for now. DPR recommends a CM gland nut torqued to 600 ft/lbs

.
Oh, and it came with a few bitch'n stickers to top it off.

For now I can trial assemble the lower end to make sure things fit correctly and once I get some cylinders I can get an idea of what spacers I need to order.

Time to decide on heads and cam. I like Tim's stage 2+ but they don't make a big enough chamber and will require some hefty deck height. Next choice is CB oval ports as you can get them 70cc, but there is really not many ways around some significant deck. Shooting for 8 to 8.25:1 static compression.

Stay tuned.

miniman82 · Post by **miniman82** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:39 am

Big difference with heads is that a stock casting won't allow you to make a very large combustion chanber, where a CB 044 will allow you to gouge the shite out of it. There is a lot more material to work with on an 044, you can tell just by looking. The 044 mags I have on my 1915 turbo came in at 65cc off the shelf, which gave me 7.3:1 compression with a .040" deck (pistons are flushed with the top of the jugs, using a copperhead gasket). Needless to say, I'll be running lots of boost in the near future.

If I were you, there'd be no question- 044's all the way.

shag55 · Post by **shag55** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:59 am

How much torque you looking for? I made just over 400lbs with mildly ported CB endcastings @ 24lbs boost. Yes the 044s are the way to go but buy them bare and have them hand ported. The cnc ovals are to big for a off road or street motor. Yes some guys are useing them with success but I have done a 2275 with them and a 2275 with a set of my custom ported sets and there was a big diffrence. Off boost responce and boost acceleration rate both pic up with the smaller ports and endcastings.

miniman82 · Post by **miniman82** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:38 am

That's why I opted for the CNC roundports, they keep gas speeds higher.

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:06 am

shag55 wrote:How much torque you looking for? I made just over 400lbs with mildly ported CB endcastings @ 24lbs boost. Yes the 044s are the way to go but buy them bare and have them hand ported. The cnc ovals are to big for a off road or street motor. Yes some guys are useing them with success but I have done a 2275 with them and a 2275 with a set of my custom ported sets and there was a big diffrence. Off boost responce and boost acceleration rate both pic up with the smaller ports and endcastings.

Hey Shag,
I am looking to make as much torque as I possibly can. The main reason I'm buildng this motor is I'm not happy with the torque a 69 stroke can make off boost. I want a torquey very responsive engine off boost, and want a thrill when it makes boost.

I am currently using a set of 044's that Mark Trembly (VW Paradise) ported for me, I would use them again but they only have 40x35 valves in them and are 10 years old. My CB end castings are also ported about as much as I could w/o welding on them.

I think I've settled on re-using the end castings, I keep hearing people making big power with them and 400 lt/lbs is more than I plan on making.

I'll send you a PM, I'd like to know about who does your heads and get some price info.

Paul H · Post by **Paul H** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 1:40 pm

If you want to try something new on the induction side I could let have a pair of these on the cheap.

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:03 am

Paul, is that a single throat throttle body on each side? Looks like your building a drag car?

Punchdrunk Monkey · Post by **Punchdrunk Monkey** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:04 pm

Looks like your coming along good. That thing is going to haul a s s. I'm glad I read this, now I'm going to install a grader blade on the rear of my Thing so you don't have any bumps in your way.

Turbo_Manx_Maniac · Post by **Turbo_Manx_Maniac** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:46 pm

Punchdrunk Monkey wrote:Looks like your coming along good. That thing is going to haul a s s. I'm glad I read this, now I'm going to install a grader blade on the rear of my Thing so you don't have any bumps in your way.

Thanks, a smooth road would let me get on it for more than 50 milliseconds.

gerico · Post by **gerico** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:50 pm

Paul H,

Interesting induction arrangement. Are the intake manifolds/TBs custom?

That has to be one of the largest intercoolers I've ever seen

Humpty · Post by **Humpty** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:44 am

Paul H wrote:

So where is the turbo going in the set-up and why are there two pipes in the centre pressure tube?