Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

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MarioVelotta
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by MarioVelotta » Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:56 pm

Make up a new table, incorporate his WOT tuning, and your cruise tuning.

You can also veal on his tune again, Except use the advanced features in VEAL to not allow changes to WOT. Sat cut it off at 75kpa.

You have some good sold data now. Just combine it with what already had. Your money isn't wasted!

Did you get any datalogs?
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Piledriver » Sat Feb 08, 2014 3:16 am

You could actually reverse engineer the "new" AFR table with a good log and spending some quality time massaging the AFR table to match the actual tune... at least in the WOT areas, a little copy and paste of the top couple lines with an old tune where it ran well everywhere could do wonders.

Turn off WB correction if on, at least until you manually correct the AFR table.
THEN you can let VEAL do it's thing. (VEAL allegedly is smart enough to deal with the correction)

It's easy to get in the habit of constantly tweking the VE table, but if the lambda delay and injector specs/dead time are sane, you will be in the noise (AFR error wise) pretty quickly.
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Piledriver » Sat Feb 08, 2014 3:26 am

Volky wrote:Pile,

The tuner did not touch the AFR table to be honest. It had the same numbers I left on it. I am going to call him up and try to settle something about this. If we can't settle I'll just go to another dyno and see what can be done.

Chip,
I'm with you, I got out of there about 10:30pm and did not review it well. I'm going to address this section to the tuner.

Thanks,

Distributor based T1 will have the numbers currently at 6k down around 2600 RPM, with no more mechanical advance from that point. That is a very reasonable place to start.
If you have tight deck, reshaped chambers and/or higher compression or such you may need far less advance, but the curve is likely to not realy change much, just shift lower overall. (example: Most T4s require less total and like more initial)
Also, do not be afraid of vacuum advance, esp if set to run well lean of stoich at cruise. (keeps EGt/CHT down)
That mix burns much slower and requires far more advance. .
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sat Feb 08, 2014 9:42 pm

Hi,

Went to turn on the car this afternoon and drained the battery. Now I have to deal with this. I'll try again tomorrow.

Thanks,
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sun Mar 09, 2014 9:35 am

Good day,

I am having problems with apparently, the spark, the car cranks but NADA. It doesn"t even pop. It has spark since I took a spark plug out and saw a very weak spark on 2,3,4 and no spark on 1.

I even played with the pots and nothing as per MSextra forum.

Any ideas??

It's to the point that the battery is drained now.

Here is a tooth logger.

Thanks in advance...
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Last edited by Volky on Sun Mar 09, 2014 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sun Mar 09, 2014 9:55 am

Here's another logger with a charged battery.
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1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Mon Mar 10, 2014 7:37 pm

Good day,

I just finished checking the car with a friend that helped me out. It has spark at the coil, fuel (you can smell it at the muffler big time) and air.

Our conclusion, spark plugs are foul. I was hoping it was something lighter than this. Just taking out the webers is a PITA but someone has to do it. :(

I'll buy some tomorrow and post the results.
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by MarioVelotta » Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:39 pm

Ugh, I feel your pain.

With a good battery or the charger attached you can try flood clear, by depressing the throttle to the floor then turning the key on and cranking for 5-10 seconds at a time, letting the starter cool and repeating this a few times to help dry the plugs. Sometimes they get so wet you need to pull and torch them off. If you have to do that. I like to get the electrode red hot to burn off all the Shits.
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2276 Turbo - 92 Octane
11.537 @ 115.74mph - 15psi
1600dp - 18sec @ 0psi :lol:
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:24 pm

Hi to all,

I haven't got the chance to change the spark plugs. I noticed, when cranking the to end lights (spark) blink which is ok but the middle one used to blink too when cranking if I'm not mistaken.

I went here:
http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic ... 01&t=44191

Played with the pots and nothing.

Anyone can shed some light on this? I thnk this is the WUE light when the car is on.

Thanks.
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sat Mar 22, 2014 7:02 pm

Hi to all,

Today I put in new plugs and still no POW... I busted my knuckles, arms and hands taking out the Webers.

I guess I'll have to resign for now. I crank and crank and it just cranks. The middle light on MS2 does not even blink now will cranking. It leads me to believe it's the ECU itself.

Any suggestions welcomed.
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Piledriver » Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:18 pm

Did it work on the bench with the stim?
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by MarioVelotta » Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:58 pm

Hey volky. I finally have some time Monday if you want to call me. Just let me know. I was at another shop last week.
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2276 Turbo - 92 Octane
11.537 @ 115.74mph - 15psi
1600dp - 18sec @ 0psi :lol:
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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Sun Mar 23, 2014 8:04 am

Hi Mario,

Monday is fine with me.

Thanks.
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Fastie » Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:15 pm

I had a problem when I pulled up to a dyno - plugged lappy in and it scrambled the ECU - no start - no LED lights. I just reflashed the ECU with the firmware again - uploaded MSQ and it was fine - perhaps try that.

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Re: Project: 1776cc MS II V. 3.0 build...

Post by Volky » Mon Mar 24, 2014 6:13 am

Fastie,

I've done that a few times already.

Yesterday I spent all morning messing with TS and suddenly it turned on, rich, rich and around 1100rpms.

All of a sudden it started bogging at idle. My car idles at 65kpa but yesterday it was at 75-85kpa, weird. I suspect it's the map sensor since I had a similar problem last year.

Today, I'm going to call Mario so he can sneak a peek :) around TS. Maybe he might point out the problem since he is more experienced in MS than I am.

Thanks,
1970 VW Beetle with 2109cc turbo with MS-II v3.0, wasted spark with MSD coilpack, dual table, launch control and 3.88 tranny. All done by me...:) t03 running 48lb. Injectors, Intercooler, Water/Meth injection at 15psi.

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