Realistic Budget for an inspiring swap newbie.

[KarmannMarco]

Guess this is my first post! And we can all see what drew me into this forum.
Most of the sticklers over at the samba get all upset at the first mention of anything non concourse correct so I think this question fits better over here.
Simple as this....
How much should I budget (minimally) to do a Subi conversion in my KG?
My 1500 SP is worth its weight in bricks so I cannot do what alot of people I see do often...selling their high $ 2000+ CC turbo aircooled motors which generally takes care of the whole swap.
I'm just a mechanically inclined random guy with a small garage , a Ghia , all the tools I need , time , and a basic budget. Not trying to be cheap but also not wanting to brake the bank.
My dream build is for a Subi flat 6 with a 5 speed as I've seen done in another Ghia and it inspired the crap out of me , but living in Colorado my Subaru engine choices are practically endless as there are more Subarus then Chevys here.
I don't need a 400+ HP monster motor as I'm trying to build a nice reliable daily driver , not a race car. Id be happy with a 160HP N/A 2.5 RS mounted to the stock 4 speed (at least I'm saying this for now)
So all considered. How much money should I budget for a basic get me going down the road swap?
Thanks in advance for taking the time to answer.

[ryans88gt]

Somewhere between $2k and $10k depending on what and how you build it.

[spud]

Depends on what parts you think you need and how you manage spending. Buy the best you can the first time around. Not the cheapest. You WILL save money in the end.

For instance, I had a DP1600 in my baja that I burned up 3 summers in a row. I believe I spent around 500 each time to rebuild. After all that expense I still only had what I started with.

I then sold my motor and trans and started looking for the most reliable power for the least cash outlay. The motor was the cheap part at $300, but a new trans to hold up to that motor was 4500+. I found a used pro built 6 rib complete with axles for half that. I have clutch dropped that 2.2 ecotec on hot pavement more times than I can count I have never had an issue. If I had kept my stock box it would have been scrap long ago. I now have 16k miles on my setup and have never had motor or trans issues.

horsepower x $ = reliability

I would figure about 5k for a subie engine swap in your KG done right.

Do your research and Good Luck

[Marc]

Retail, done right, you'd pay $6K or more for parts & labor....If you shop your ass off for the parts and can do most of the work yourself, much less is possible. I think spud's number's about right - hopefully you won't need it all, but you should probably have that much in the bank before you start if you want to avoid being another "abandoned for lack of funds" statistic (those are the guys who who'll find selling the adaption parts at deeply discounted prices).

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewto ... ?p=4718899


OBTW....160HP is pushing it with a stock trans IMO. If you possess superhuman self-control it may hold up; if/when it breaks you'll have the option of buying another used stocker - and loosening the throttle cable or digging deep for another ~$2500 for a trans that's worthy.

[Buggin_74]

The stock trans are stronger than people give them credit for.
A mates daily driver is a Super Beetle thats been going for 7 years with a WRX turbo engine and a stock unknown history trans.

My trans is the original one to my car and now has over half a million KMs on it.
I had it "freshened up" 16 years ago and since then its done about 170,000kms without even an oil level check let alone a change.

My Subi conversion is putting out 180hp and had been running with that trans for about 80,000kms when I had it pulled down about a year ago for a taller 4th, Super Diff, weddle thrust plate and a few other goodies.

It only showed signs of normal wear and tear.
I'm certainly not abusive to it but I didnt put that engine in to drive like a nanna and not enjoy all the power its got.


Anyway on the original topic all I can do is give you my experience.
the more you do yourself the cheaper it works out, I did all mine myself except I farmed out shortening the sump and stripping down the loom and it worked out cheaper than properly rebuilding a stock 1600 VW engine.

I picked up a Legacy for cheap ($500) because some kids jumped on the roof.
A $480 adapter kit, $250 on the loom prepping, $600 on the sump shortening (something I could have done myself for nothing but didnt want leaks) and another $500 on the various bits and pieces to make up the cooling system, exhaust and fuel system.

That was 6 years and almost 100,000kms ago and it still puts a smile on my face everytime I drive it.

[KarmannMarco]

thanks for the opinions guys.
I will be doing the job completely by myself with the exception of maybe the wiring harness.
Im mechanically inclined enough and I know my way around a welder enough I think I can do it.
As mentioned before Im not looking for a race car and I wont be dumping the clutch every chance I get.
I think I can make a stock tranny last the way I drive and also keeping in mind whatever engine I go with will most likely be under 200hp.
Anyways. For now I will try to keep my 1500 SP alive until all the stars align and I have a solid chunk of cash saved up.

On another note...has anyone done a subi swap and then converted the car to carburation? I know thats going backwards with technology but it would be cool to have a subi flat 6 with a couple of weber 44s and trumpets for that vintage look.

[panel]

http://s53.photobucket.com/user/55super ... t=3&page=1

Check posts for 55superbeetle on here and the samba.

[KarmannMarco]

Thanks for that. That EJ22 carbed swap just inspired the crap out of me. I'll need to do the research now!

[ErikTande]

It's going to be a lot higher than you expect, just plan on that.

I recently did a build/restore on an older eclipse, and I kept EVERY single receipt for the job. The big costs are easy to total up and base your estimate on, but I have almost a couple thousand dollars in misc stuff. Nuts and bolts from the hardware store, engine degreasers, shop towels, tools I had to buy that I didn't have, small fittings, adapters, lines, hoses, washers, bushings, fluids, etc....

It's those $5 to $10 items that end up costing a lot of money over the course of a build.

[surfbeetle]

Get a plan together and a parts list, research your prices, get your budget together. Take that budget and add a lot of padding to it. A major decision is going to be the trans. If you go type 1, then you also need to spring for an adapter plate but if you go subagears, no adapter needed. If you go with a bus trans with the removable bellhousing, there's a bellhousing available that allows for the use of the stock subaru flywheel and starter. Also you have to decide your engine management, stock subaru, megasquirt, link, etc. Good luck.