71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

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Master slacker
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by Master slacker » Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:36 am

Just to throw an idea out there from left field, what about running all vents to the suction side of the turbo, BUT before getting to the turbo have a demister canister that will catch and drain the condensed oil vapors back to the crank case and allow the non-condensables to flow on to the turbo inlet?

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Mon Jul 06, 2015 1:05 pm

Master slacker wrote:Just to throw an idea out there from left field, what about running all vents to the suction side of the turbo, BUT before getting to the turbo have a demister canister that will catch and drain the condensed oil vapors back to the crank case and allow the non-condensables to flow on to the turbo inlet?
The advantage of running the PCV to the manifold is that during normal driving the manifold vacuum is controlling oil vapor and drawing moisture and volatiles out of the oil, but under heavy acceleration, the PCV closes, letting the gases out of the breather. The advantage to what you suggest is that you do not get oil vapors exiting to the atmosphere (and all over your engine bay) under WOT. So... great for emissions. Some manufacturers do run a system somewhat like that, but in combination with a PCV (as is similar to the stock subie setup). The major disadvantage to routing like that is that most of the ventilation is going to happen at WOT, which is the last time you want oil vapors introduced into the intake and combustion chamber. The condensers are not perfect and even a little oil vapor significantly increases the chance of preignition/detonation, so not great for a turbo engine. Also under normal driving, there will be little to no vacuum in front of the turbo, so it isn't going to help ventilate the crank case much during normal driving.

jhoefer
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by jhoefer » Mon Jul 06, 2015 2:26 pm

ryans88gt wrote:I do have a question about the IAC and PCV systems. My plan was to use a small breather filter on each valve cover and connect the pcv valve on the intake manifold to the crank case vent. That way under normal operation manifold vacuum draws blow by from the crank case and fresh air in through the valve covers. Under boost/pcv closes off and the breathers let out blow by gasses. For the iac i am just going to stick a filter right on it. I am going to use a mass air based microsquirt system... So i am not concerned with metered vs unmetered air.

Does that all sound right to you guys?
Since you say you are planning on using a MAF sensor, you absolutely have to be concerned with unmetered air. In the normal subaru setup, crankcase breathing is from a post-MAF/pre-turbo intake fitting into the valve cover breathers, through the crankcase, out the crankcase vent, and into the PCV valve. This way all air entering the manifold has already been metered by the MAF sensor. By venting the valve covers to atmosphere, your PCV valve now represents a large vacuum leak in your manifold. Same goes for your IAC. That's only going to work if you are running speed-density, not mass air flow.

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surfbeetle
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by surfbeetle » Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:03 pm

_______________
'67 Bug EJ20 Turbo
Build Thread

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:11 pm

jhoefer wrote:
ryans88gt wrote:I do have a question about the IAC and PCV systems. My plan was to use a small breather filter on each valve cover and connect the pcv valve on the intake manifold to the crank case vent. That way under normal operation manifold vacuum draws blow by from the crank case and fresh air in through the valve covers. Under boost/pcv closes off and the breathers let out blow by gasses. For the iac i am just going to stick a filter right on it. I am going to use a mass air based microsquirt system... So i am not concerned with metered vs unmetered air.

Does that all sound right to you guys?
Since you say you are planning on using a MAF sensor, you absolutely have to be concerned with unmetered air. In the normal subaru setup, crankcase breathing is from a post-MAF/pre-turbo intake fitting into the valve cover breathers, through the crankcase, out the crankcase vent, and into the PCV valve. This way all air entering the manifold has already been metered by the MAF sensor. By venting the valve covers to atmosphere, your PCV valve now represents a large vacuum leak in your manifold. Same goes for your IAC. That's only going to work if you are running speed-density, not mass air flow.
Sorry, meant to say I am using speed density based microsquirt and not a MAF. I agree with the rest of what you stated. Thanks for reading and providing a detailed response.

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panel
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by panel » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:18 pm

There should be a PDF on this somewhere. Ill be runing mine like this with the PCV in place.

http://perrinperformance.com/i-14908570 ... x-sti.html

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:22 pm

Well kind of aggravated with the microsquirt... I am unable to get tunerstudio or portchecker or MS2loader to see it. I can jumper the two serial pins and bounce back data. I can power up the microsquirt and connect it, see 5V at Vref, so I know it is powered up.

But no connection with any of the software.

Using the same serial port I can connect via Logworks to my innovate wideband without issue.

So I sent the microsquirt back to get checked out and they said it checked out fine and reloaded the firmware for me. Sent it back...

still no connection... I am not really sure where to go from here. I have tried 2 laptops, one running vista 32 bit, one running Windows 8 64 bit, two different USB serial adapters, multiple different drivers... I can always get the port to bounce data back when jumpering the serial pins, but never get it to talk to the microsquirt.

Anyone have experience with this??

I've got no subbie computer or any of the wiring, so I have no way to get this thing running without getting the microsquirt up and running. It's one of those deals that may kill the project before I get much further. :/

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Mon Aug 03, 2015 11:21 pm

well finally got the microsquirt to work using a tunerstudio purchased FTDI based USB/serial converter.

Back to wiring...

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:55 pm

Wiring up the microsquirt... I've got a relay that powers the unit on start up. The fuel pump ground from the computer triggers the relay for the injectors, coil, wideband, and fuel pump. Although now that I think about it, I probably want the wideband to be on whenever the key is on so that I can calibrate it more easily (without the car running).

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Also I picked up this tiny turbo blanket. How cute. ;)

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:51 pm

Well... decided to go with the stock style alt bracket and just trimmed it up with the help of the sawzall and smoothed a little with the flap wheel. Shot of graphite wheel paint... and not looking too bad. Also got the engine harness wired up, tested all the injectors... unstuck three of them that were stuck. Tested the newer style coil. Tested out the idle air control valve and TPS sensor. Measured the resistance for the ECT and ACT sensors. Seems just about ready to go.

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:55 pm

OK, so I cut 1.5 inches off the bottom of my oil pan today using a body saw. Had a piece of 3/16" steel about the same size. Welded it in place. Drilled out the spot welds on the factory drain plug threaded piece and welded it to the outside of the plate steel.

I'd love to say I tested it and it had no leaks... but in reality there were two spots I had to go back and fix some pin holes .... then found another leak around the drain plug. Finally got it all water/oil tight. Then I had to clean all the metal shavings and poop out of it. Slapped a coat of pain on it.... and not too bad. Now it is no lower than the exhaust, which I can't imagine there is an exhaust with more ground clearance. Figure I picked up at least an inch of ground clearance. Took me about 3 hours of work. Should be able to jack the car up from the oil pan with the 3/16" plate. :)

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If anybody is reading this, please post up with a comment on how crappy my welds are.

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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Sun Oct 04, 2015 2:38 pm

Making some slow progress. Turbo is mounted. Check out the mini turbo blanket.
I got the engine off the engine stand and put it on my new 500 lb hydraulic roller cart. Already really like this thing.

I did replace the plastic breather cover with the subaru metal cover with some grey RTV. Got the KEP adapter plate in. No instructions anywhere, so I torqued to 45 ftlbs. If anyone has the torque specs for the trans/clutch stuff let me know... I started another thread about it.

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panel
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by panel » Sun Oct 04, 2015 3:12 pm

Where's your turbo blanket from ?


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ryans88gt
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Re: 71 bug - planned EJ20t swap - new member

Post by ryans88gt » Sat Oct 24, 2015 9:43 pm

Well I got the beetle out of storage to start the swap. Will start in just a few weeks.

Meanwhile I took the time to build a solid trans/subaru motor mount. I looked around quite a bit and doesn't appear that anybody makes anything like this. I wanted to move the engine and trans forward, so I started with a flipped solid mount. I had to do some cutting and clearancing for the bolts in the KEP adapter where they would interfere with the flipped mount. Then I welded some motor mount pads on their and triangulated with some heavy duty gussets. Finally added some grooves for the bolts so it will be easy to slide the engine on to the mount and transaxle at the same time. Fits pretty good. Pretty happy with my handy work... took awhile though.

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