EJ20G into 67 Bug

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surfbeetle
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EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:15 am

There was a forum upgrade and the photo links were lost in the database by the upgrade process according to the forum admin. I've re-uploaded the missing photos so that's why many of my posts have a last edited date of Sun Mar 05, 2017

Here's my build thread, been working on it for a long time, things never go as fast as you want...

My car is a 1967 bug body on a 68 pan with the 67 swingaxle trans. I've had this car for close to 25 years. It had a stock 1600 when I got it and I painted it back in high school autoshop. Then after a few years, I put a 1641 with dual Kadrons. Next was a old 1835 I found that had been built by Deano Dyno Soars. It had Deano heads, carb linkage, and IDA manifolds for the 48 IDA Webers. The best part was paying $1200.00 for the turnkey motor back in the '90s and I did low 14s at Carlsbad Raceway's 1/4 mile. At some point during that time, I had the trans built up with welded gears, super diff, side plate, etc. Then life got in the way and the car has been sitting in my garage for the last 8 years.
carlsbadcraigvstroy.jpg
carlsbadcraigAV.jpg
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Last edited by surfbeetle on Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:34 am

A couple of years ago, I was planning a turbo EFI 2275 Type1. One of my good friends suggested I look at a subaru motor instead and that's what I ended up doing. I looked on ebay and found several vendors. I went with CNS Motors in El Monte Calfornia http://cnsmotors.com. The EJ20G turbo I picked up was around $650, I can't remember exactly, it was a couple of years ago now. I did not pay shipping as I am in Southern Ca and the wife, kids and I took a drive on a Saturday morning to go and pickup the motor. Its a ej20G from a 89-93 legacy turbo.
I don't know why the pictures show on my first post, but don't on this one, you can click on the links to see photos of my motor when I first got it.
suby1.jpg
suby2.jpg
suby3.jpg
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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:56 am

I bought the adapter from Kennedy Engineering along with the flywheel and clutch/pressure plate, that cost more than the motor. Later I found out about Outback, later renamed to Outfront Motorsports where they sell the Kennedy stuff as well. There's lots of good info on their website, www.outfrontmotorsports.com. There's also a bunch of info on these other sites as well:
http://forums.nasioc.com - subaru forum
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/ - vw forum
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/ - non vw conversions section
http://www.vwkd.co.uk/bb/
http://www.dunebuggyarchives.com/forum/ ... .pl?bid=25 Subaru buggy forum
http://www.dunebuggyarchives.com/forum/ ... l?tid=1491 This build has a car similar to mine.
http://www.cal-look.com/
Needless to say, I have done a bunch of research online for this

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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:16 am

I have decided to use a rear mounted radiator. I know it's not the best option, but there are a few who have done it successfully. Here's links to their builds:
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/view ... ?tid=66118
http://www.dunebuggyarchives.com/forum/ ... l?tid=1491

I'm going to use a Jeep Cherokee radiator behind the back seat. It measures 11 inches high by 31 inches wide. I cut the rear firewall out behind the back seat and made the rear apron removable. Also, since I'm running a swingaxle, I can't move the engine and trans forward like the IRS cars. So to clear the upper cam covers, I added some spacers at the rear most body mount by the top of the shock. It raised up the body just enough that when the rear of the body hits the area by the cam covers, it clears the body line. My decklid shuts completely and you can't tell that there isn't a vw engine in there. Evidently, these spacers are used on convertibles to set the body gap on the doors. I loosened up the pan at the rear by the battery and then put my spacers in at the rear mount. Then I tightened up the other pan bolts that I loosened.
DSCN1482.jpg
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DSCN1461.jpg
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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:26 am

Here's some more photos of my progress.
IMG_20110122_205436.jpg
IMG_20110122_205419.jpg
IMG_20110122_205410.jpg
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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:31 am

Here are some photos of the framework I am building to clear the cam covers. I have widened the engine compartment around the area of the valve covers by adding some angle pieces and flat metal.
IMG_20110131_195758.jpg
IMG_20110131_195822.jpg
IMG_20110131_195816.jpg
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itawolf
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by itawolf » Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:47 pm

looking good --keep on posting
RET Marine 0317 --with VW on the lobe!!
Lots of iron in the fire

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itawolf
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by itawolf » Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:48 pm

keep us posted --looking good
RET Marine 0317 --with VW on the lobe!!
Lots of iron in the fire

Mooosman
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by Mooosman » Sun Feb 06, 2011 2:28 pm

Looks pretty good. I hope the rear mounted radiator works out for you, a lot of people seem to have problems staying cool when mounting them back there. I guess it depends on the average temperature where you live.

How are you planning on ducting air to the radiator?


Nick

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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:39 pm

Nick, on youtube, I saw a guy in Las Vegas using scoops under the car to point the air up to the radiator and also saw the black and white 65 in another post is using an oil cooler in addition to the radiator. I figure I am going to try the rear first based on these other guys builds and worst case is it moves to the front. Where I live is a lot cooler than Las Vegas so we'll have to see.

Since I only got the engine, I had no ECU to speak of. I got lucky and found a Link ECU on Ebay complete with a wiring harness. The guy I bought it from had a sand rail with the same motor and was changing out his motor and could not use the ECU anymore. I got it and was excited to see that the harness plugged right in.

Also for the fuel lines, I am going to copy what Mooosman has done in his build. I ordered the Fox/Scirocco fuel reservoir yesterday. viewtopic.php?f=19&t=132524

I found Joel's (Buggin_74) thread over on Aussieveedubbers to be extremely helpful especially with the wiring of the alternator.
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/view ... ?tid=77027

Things I still need to sort out are:
What I can remove from the intake manifold because I am using the Link ECU instead of a subaru ECU.
My ducting for the Radiator, which fans to use
Radiator hoses
Fuel pump, fuel line install
exhaust piping, I have an exhaust flange that I need to add exhaust pipe to. I want to route it to dual quiet pack exhaust.

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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:32 am

I got out in the garage for a couple of hours today before the Super Bowl. Did some welding and grinding on the right rear side of the engine compartment, to make it match the left side. I'm gonna try to get more time tomorrow.

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Camo
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by Camo » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:52 am

Good stuff and its always good to see other possible options that people have taken or are undertaking. My old 61 is still swing axle and this was one issue with me thinking of going Subaru, but you have solved the problem and it seems such a simple way around the cam covers hitting on the rear body :D

Keep up the great work and also the photos as it helps out heaps of others.

Thanks, Kev

Mooosman
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by Mooosman » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:42 pm

For the radiator hoses, I can only add that I tried to use the smallest amount of rubber hose that I could get away with. Right now, the longest section of radiator hose is about 9" long. My cooling system mostly uses little 5" long pieces of rubber hose as connectors between steel pipe and the engine and pipe to radiator. This way, you only have to change out little sections of hose, rather than buy intricate sections of molded hose at the auto parts store.

You can have a local muffler shop bend up some 1.5" exhaust tubing to connect your engine to your radiator, and then use short sections of rubber to splice it all together.


Good luck, and keep posting pics! 8)

Mooosman
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by Mooosman » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:20 pm

surfbeetle wrote:Nick, on youtube, I saw a guy in Las Vegas using scoops under the car to point the air up to the radiator and also saw the black and white 65 in another post is using an oil cooler in addition to the radiator. I figure I am going to try the rear first based on these other guys builds and worst case is it moves to the front. Where I live is a lot cooler than Las Vegas so we'll have to see.
I also live in Las Vegas. As I said, good luck with mounting the radiator at the back. I think you're going to get very annoyed at the electric fans running ALL THE TIME, which they are going to have to do. Even with ducting, there is not going to be a lot of natural airflow underneath the car when you're moving, so the fans are still going to be running much of the time. The car may stay cool around town, because there is less load on the engine, but on the highway I'll bet you see your temps creep up, even with the fans going.

By mounting the radiator in the front, you get to take advantage of 2 things:

1. Undisturbed airflow. You are getting clean airflow into the radiator any time the car is moving, and that means the fans don't have to work as hard. The only time my fan kicks on is when I am sitting in traffic for 5-10 minutes. Other than that, it hardly ever runs, and never for more than 2-3 minutes at a time.

2. Free cooling! If you run steel pipes from a front-mounted radiator back to the engine, you are essentially adding a bigger radiator to the car. All of that piping hanging under the car is shedding heat as the airflow under the car goes by, helping to cool the water. And, it is not an insignificant amount; think of the surface area of (on my car) about 25 feet of 1.5" pipe. That's a lot of area exposed to the air, and it is all shedding heat as I drive along. By mounting the radiator at the back, you're not taking advantage of this.


Look at what the factories have done: where do Porsche 911, Lamborghini, and Ferrari put their radiators for all their mid engine/rear engine cars? In the front! The 911 uses 2 small radiators at the front of the car, and pipes run the coolant to the back.

I know you've already cut the body, but I just hate having to see people do things twice. :?

Nick

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surfbeetle
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Re: EJ20G into 67 Bug

Post by surfbeetle » Tue Feb 08, 2011 1:00 am

Nick,
I know you're correct regarding the cooling and I was leaning that way until seeing the rear mounted cars and figured I would give it a shot. I have also been considering side vents cut into the rear fender and ducted into the back. I'll just have to see what happens.

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