What the heck is what?
All i know is superbeetle stuff cause thats what i have...i want to get building on a baja project but i know what kinda suspension i need. I know swing axle is bad, and so is McPherson.
And while im on the topic....if anyone wants to help me on dates with suspension that would be cool. 68 (Standard and Super)-on= IRS....71 Super - on = McPherson. And all standards have kingpin or linkpin.....what is the best year for baja conversions?
Difference between linkpin and kingpin....
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kangaboy
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adrenalnjunky
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2002 12:01 am
Link/King are both descriptions of the early-style front suspension (66 and earlier?) before the balljoint front ends came around, and then the strut front ends of the supers.
Good diagrams here: http://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=118332
Good diagrams here: http://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=118332
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DutchBug
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adrenalnjunky
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kangaboy
- Posts: 1034
- Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2003 12:01 am
k...well now that i realize that king and link are just two different components on the same suspension, what year is that? im trying to order new tie rods and ends for my buggy and i dont know what year to order...i have a king/link front end. their is like three choices and i dont know what one to get.
http://www.aircooled.net/new-bin/viewpr ... 02&cartid=
Im replacing both sides.
http://www.aircooled.net/new-bin/viewpr ... 02&cartid=
Im replacing both sides.
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Ol'fogasaurus
- Posts: 17756
- Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:17 pm
This is a general discussion and is not in great detail. It would be nice to see this or another version cleaned up and made a sticky as this question does come up on a regular basis.
This king (pin) and Link (pin) front end was the early version of the VW torsion bar front suspension. VW replaced the early version with the ball-joint version in 1966. Both versions have torsion bar packs (each configured a little differently) that reside inside of both upper and a lower torsion tubes. The two versions of the front beam are not readily interchangeable as the distances between the upper tube and the lower tube are different between the two versions. The frame head has to be modified or changed in order to change over from one version to the other.
Besides the two torsion tubes/bars, there are upper and lower trailing arms with the lower trailing arms also being the lower mount for the shock. The king and link trailing arms and the ball-joint trailing arms are not interchangeable. The upper shock tower is vertical and accepts shocks with an eye type of mounting similar to the eye mounting on the lower part of the shock. There is a steering knuckle that attaches to the trailing arms by “link pins” which also hold the shim. Both shims and the link pins are used to align the front end. The steering knuckle also holds the bushing for the king pin to which the spindle attaches to the steering knuckle and pivots on. The brakes drums and bearings are both different than the ball-joint drums and bearings. The brake drums can be either bolt or five bolt wheel mount. By its design, the king and link front end is capable of longer travel and is (considered) stronger than the ball-joint front end with the exception of the spindle itself which has a smaller diameter.
The ball-joint beams has the two torsion tubes sitting together closer than the king and link front beams (the king and link front beams are also know as either “king pin” or “link pin” front ends but are the same thing). The shock towers are much different as they angle towards the outside or the car and have a hat like (derby) mount for a post style shock. There are also two trailing arms per side to which the ball-joints attach. The ball joints press in from the center with the Type 181(Thing) spindles being the exception as the lower Ball-joint pressing in from the bottom. The Thing’s spindle itself sits in a position that when used on a bus sedan, the front end will sit about 2 ½ to 3 inches higher than it would with the normal B/J spindle.. On the upper ball joint is an eccentric which is used to align the front end. The brake drums are usually four lug and the wheel bearings are different than the king and link bearings so the drums usually are not interchangable. Travel in the front end is limited by the slots in the ball-joints themselves. There are ball-joints that allow for a tad more travel but it is felt by some that they end up weakening the front end and they require more inspection and service.
I think there is an early and late steering box differentiated by the shaft the Pittman are fits to. Other wise they should be interchangeable.
This king (pin) and Link (pin) front end was the early version of the VW torsion bar front suspension. VW replaced the early version with the ball-joint version in 1966. Both versions have torsion bar packs (each configured a little differently) that reside inside of both upper and a lower torsion tubes. The two versions of the front beam are not readily interchangeable as the distances between the upper tube and the lower tube are different between the two versions. The frame head has to be modified or changed in order to change over from one version to the other.
Besides the two torsion tubes/bars, there are upper and lower trailing arms with the lower trailing arms also being the lower mount for the shock. The king and link trailing arms and the ball-joint trailing arms are not interchangeable. The upper shock tower is vertical and accepts shocks with an eye type of mounting similar to the eye mounting on the lower part of the shock. There is a steering knuckle that attaches to the trailing arms by “link pins” which also hold the shim. Both shims and the link pins are used to align the front end. The steering knuckle also holds the bushing for the king pin to which the spindle attaches to the steering knuckle and pivots on. The brakes drums and bearings are both different than the ball-joint drums and bearings. The brake drums can be either bolt or five bolt wheel mount. By its design, the king and link front end is capable of longer travel and is (considered) stronger than the ball-joint front end with the exception of the spindle itself which has a smaller diameter.
The ball-joint beams has the two torsion tubes sitting together closer than the king and link front beams (the king and link front beams are also know as either “king pin” or “link pin” front ends but are the same thing). The shock towers are much different as they angle towards the outside or the car and have a hat like (derby) mount for a post style shock. There are also two trailing arms per side to which the ball-joints attach. The ball joints press in from the center with the Type 181(Thing) spindles being the exception as the lower Ball-joint pressing in from the bottom. The Thing’s spindle itself sits in a position that when used on a bus sedan, the front end will sit about 2 ½ to 3 inches higher than it would with the normal B/J spindle.. On the upper ball joint is an eccentric which is used to align the front end. The brake drums are usually four lug and the wheel bearings are different than the king and link bearings so the drums usually are not interchangable. Travel in the front end is limited by the slots in the ball-joints themselves. There are ball-joints that allow for a tad more travel but it is felt by some that they end up weakening the front end and they require more inspection and service.
I think there is an early and late steering box differentiated by the shaft the Pittman are fits to. Other wise they should be interchangeable.
Lee
My opinion is worth slightly less than what you paid for it.
My opinion is worth slightly less than what you paid for it.