Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

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cal 67
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Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by cal 67 » Thu May 11, 2017 12:00 am

I've been commissioned to build an 82x103 engine. I'll be using the new AA 914 bare castings, and sending them off to a head porter with a flow bench. For 220-250 HP, what exactly do I need as far as head specs? What size valves? How much welding? Any strengthening modifications? What manifolds would be advantageous to use that need the least amount of modification? We're considering Adrian at Flowmasters. Are there any other head guys with flow bench capabilities? This is going in a split Bus for steet/drag.

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Piledriver
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by Piledriver » Fri May 12, 2017 4:08 am

Would love to see some pics of those AA 914 castings, have yet to hear of anyone running them.
Hard to guess what mods they need/take without closely comparing to std.
I believe AA gets the T4 castings from QSC.

Intake port welding is typically needed for anything over 46mm, the std T4 manifolds have plenty of meat, but can be welded to suit.

You may want to move the exhaust over a little to allow 52x40.
The typical T4 head deck is relatively thin, if you can get them in 100mm register consider a step cut and moving the seal near the heads surface for more meat. (piston top will stick out, just leave top ring ~1mm in the hole)

QSC had some bare 910 clones in small or large port that may make a better base if really hunting big numbers.
They don't have the deck thickness issues, at least the Autocraft version didn't.
If obtainable undrilled, they can be set up for T4s, at least if a good copy.
May need water jackets for street use... but that would probably require less (and easier) welding than the T4 heads/

910s also greatly simplifies the exhaust thing.
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falcor
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by falcor » Fri May 12, 2017 4:41 am


wreck
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by wreck » Fri May 12, 2017 7:13 am

the valve size and port size will depend on what revs you want the engine to spin to , I've a slightly smaller engine 103x78. it's getting 47mm in and 40mm ex . valves the smallest port size recommended on pipemax is 42mm . thats aiming for peak hp around 6800 . FAT Performance are another company to speak to as well as EMW . both have a long history with performance type 4 's
A link to some good info from Len Hoffman .

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 96#p492496
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bj
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by bj » Thu May 18, 2017 12:05 pm

Just wondering at what price point would something like Pauter Type 4 heads be considered? i think they're like $3k-ish? i remember my rebuilt bus 2.0 heads from EMW was $1100...and that was for installing new studs and 44x38 valves and no porting. just wondering.

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Piledriver
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by Piledriver » Thu May 18, 2017 12:27 pm

If you are looking for big power NA, or considering going boosted, the Engine Plus or similar heads from Europe are in play.
(esp with the Euro vs $ exchange rate)
They have thick decks and >2x more cooling fin area than the Pauters.

Wally has a build going using those IIRC.
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wreck
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by wreck » Fri May 19, 2017 6:18 pm

http://www.tp-technologie.de/index.htm.

Thorsten Pieper from Germany does billet heads , I think these are what Wally is using , I got a set of tool steel lifters and bushes off him sent to Australia . He was very easy to deal with .
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Piledriver
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by Piledriver » Fri May 19, 2017 7:39 pm

Don't forget to take ~20% off as no VAT(included in price), but there may be a customs duty and of course shipping/insurance.

IIRC dual plugs option is only an extra $100 or so.
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bj
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by bj » Fri May 19, 2017 11:50 pm

man...why do kids have to be so dang expensive...maybe if i put a kidney on Craigslist... :shock: :lol:

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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by Piledriver » Sat May 20, 2017 7:36 am

bj wrote:
Fri May 19, 2017 11:50 pm
man...why do kids have to be so dang expensive...maybe if i put a kidney on Craigslist... :shock: :lol:
...It's that or one of the kids :twisted:
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

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bj
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by bj » Mon May 22, 2017 6:29 pm

the wife and i can't agree which one is our favorite...so i guess we have to keep both!... :mrgreen:

cal 67
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by cal 67 » Sun May 28, 2017 11:51 pm

Oh, hey guys! The responses were a little late, so I thought there weren't too many around anymore. I've been away for awhile from STF. Let me figure how to upload pics.

Oh btw, I may get flamed for this, but Anthony "Cub" DeLatorre from CB will be doing the heads now....IN HOUSE! I just requested that he provided me intake/exhaust flow numbers at .100" increments. Anthony is well versed in fluid dynamics, and isn't just a T1 head guy. He's been reworking heads for over 30 years.

Still collecting parts and learning more, but so far we have a 82mm DPR full circle Chevy jrl crank, Thorsten Pieper 56g tool steel lifters, and a 2.0 case, prepped by Rimco many moons ago. This will be occasionally drag raced in a split panel Bus, but must be liveable on the street.

The rest of the specs:

103mm JE custom pistons (slightly oversize to re-hone barrels), high pins that run under the oil rings
5.325 Chevy CB H-beams
Kennedy conversion flywheel
SCAT straight cut gears
CB/Manton aluminum dual-taper pushrods
Europeans pushrod tubes
Case sleeved by European, 1/2" thru bolt mod by European, 103 bore by European, European chromoly head studs, tapped galleries by European
SCAT sump
European's 103mm cylinders, precision honed to accept larger cylinders
AA's castings, welded to accept porting, possible exhaust port mods that European does, and 103 bore, sending to CB for bench work, all Race Master valve train components (valves .053" longer than T4, springs .140" wider than stock T4)
Mario Velotta 45-48mm throttle bodies
Rockers, not sure. Depends on flow numbers. I modified a set of stock 2.0s to accept Thorsten adjusters, but I may use Europeans aluminum 1.45 ratio rockers depending on flow numbers attained
Not sure on cam, will depend on flow data. I'll use a formula to determine peak rpm, then select a cam afterwards

cal 67
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by cal 67 » Mon May 29, 2017 12:03 am

Oh crazy! That worked! Not sure how you guys upload pics, but I pulled this from my images on The Samba. This is European's mod for the exhaust port on an AMC head.

Image

cal 67
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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by cal 67 » Mon May 29, 2017 12:14 am

The casting pics are too large. Can anyone help me with a way to get them from my phone onto here?

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Re: Big CFM 914 Heads In U.S.A.

Post by Piledriver » Mon May 29, 2017 1:50 am

Text them you yourself? should give you a size option.

Turn those into D ports and you have a short turn radius.
Huge exhaust ports destroy Tq. Make them flow properly, and its a win all around.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

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