re oil cooler ,doghouse or external what is better

[damo99]

i have just finished my 2270cc motor and was thinking about witch oil
cooler to use in my cali style conversion .
in the 2056cc i have in the bus now i am using a type 4 cooler in the doghouse
fanshroud .it stays pretty cool most days ,except when it's real hot weather ,it
starts to get a little warm after a very long drive,(but not to hot)..
but have been looking at the new dtm's and noticed that they are now using remote coolers .
as i have a 72 pass oil cooler and fan i was thinking of using that above the gearbox
and take the stock cooler out of the shroud to let more air get to #3 cylinder from the fan .
my question is do you think i would get better cooling with the remote cooler
(i would use a thermostat for warmup )
or stick with the doghouse style stock type 4 cooler

[Piledriver]

Removing the oil cooler on a doghouse shroud will not magically send any more air to #3.
It's not in the way, and blocking off that air channel that feeds the cooler may or may not boost the airflow to the rest of the cylinders... It very well may do the opposite, or cause imbalances. Careful measurements will have to be made to know.

The DTMV2 AFAIK was created primarily due to the V1 not fitting in a 914 and perhaps some early model T1s.
...Not because there was anything in particular deficient about the T4 oil cooler used in the V1.
Has the V1 been discontinued?

In some extreme apps an external cooler may be required, but its a lot more work and risk of leaks, and likely not needed on anything short of extreme use...
Maybe needed in a Bay Bus, maybe not. greatly depends on use/climate/right foot.
Easy enough to add a supplemental cooler via a sandwich adapter in any case.

I would probably try a T1 cooler in the doghouse before hacking in a T4 cooler again, you end up with the same airflow so the difference is unlikely to be huge. My sons 2L in a 71 super had overcooling issues, both oil and CHT with a Cali setup, in dead of summer in Dallas.

I have been running a t1 oil cooler on my T4 for a few years now (2? 3?) with no oil temp or pressure issues.
(needed room for AC compressor setup in a T3, the AC clutch just interferes a tiny bit)

Adding the variable displacement Delphi V7 compressor had no apparent effect on oil temps when AC is running, and barely has an effect on idle speed.
It always "soft starts" at 5% displacement.

[wreck]

I'd run the doghouse cooler first and see what your oil temps are like , then if it runs hot put the 72 pass with a sandwich plate on the filter , simple. Also invest in a CHT gauge of some description .you can have enough coolers and still over heat a head. I'm using a multimeter at the moment but will get a MGL TC-1 shortly.

I like the oil kept below 95c and run a standard cooler (doesn't get enough air flow) plus a rotary cooler and two 72 plate coolers with a thermosat, the coolers are tucked up between the chassis rails and also don't get good airflow but since I take the kombi off road it is a compromise between cooling and being vulnerable to damaged. I've spray bars in the rocker covers that also reduce head temps but increase oil temps(original idea on the spray bars was to increase valve guide life) .

Pile what is a good CHT to aim for,whats considered to cold. After making a new header (1 5/8 was 1 1/2 ) and opening up my exhaust ports my head temps have dropped a lot, normal driving 100km/h @3200rpm on a 30C day sees head temps of 160C which I'm happy with ,around town 140C .

Damo are you going to Nambucca ? if so we'll have to meet up and have a laugh over the crankshaft fiasco .

[Piledriver]

My apologies in advance for my non-SI temps...

Over 275F
under 375F
If you can MAINTAIN 350-375 under all conditions that would be ~awesome, but a hard target to hit on any aircooled engine given wildly varying load and outside air temp swings even with a perfectly working stock Tstat setup.

We have previously discussed creating a thermostat controlled hotside<>coldside cooling air "leak" to speed warmup and improve regulation.
I suspect the mexican T1 wax-pill tstat would be ~ideal for the hotside as when it fails, the hot air recirc flaps would be closed.
A bellows is still best for the "cool air" side as it fails with the cooling flaps wide open.

Oil: Over 190F, under ~240, with rapid warm up.
Anything less makes Vaseline, anything more cooks your oil, a T4 in normal use should be able to go 10-12K miles between oil changes with good oil and filter.
Really need a real oil thermostat to hit that, even with a stock oil cooler.

The increased oil temps from the spraybars just means they work, they are also cooling your heads some.
Not a bug.
Would love to see how you implemented it.

[wreck]

I'm running a "empi" type thermostat as well as the standard thermostat in the rotary RX7 cooler . I've just finished a DIY water injection system ,.4mm nozzles, it comes on over 2700 rpm and is regulated with a simple 4mm festo ball valve coupled to the cross bar (dual 45mm Dels) , 80psi RV water pump and a needle valve to restrict the flow.
testing today on a long pull up a hill in top gear showed the CHTs maintaining 335F , I've never had such stable head temps. .

[Piledriver]

I'm running a "empi" type thermostat as well as the standard thermostat in the rotary RX7 cooler . I've just finished a DIY water injection system ,.4mm nozzles, it comes on over 2700 rpm and is regulated with a simple 4mm festo ball valve coupled to the cross bar (dual 45mm Dels) , 80psi RV water pump and a needle valve to restrict the flow.
testing today on a long pull up a hill in top gear showed the CHTs maintaining 335F , I've never had such stable head temps. .

Slick!

Might want to add a thermo-switch so it doesn't kick on until the engine is warmed up.
One of the little bullet proof "clicker" temp switches they use in furnaces & electric heating (due to safety//reliability) would probably work great.
You can get them set over a huge temperature range, and they are dirt cheap due to being so widely used.
(used as control and as safety devices in everything from coffee pots to industrial control systems)

Saw a funny the other day on TOS:
EMPI: "Every Malfunction Passes Inspection"

[damo99]

thanks guys . i will run with the doghouse cooler and see how it goes .
i have digital dakota cylinder head temp and oil temp gauges ,i heard they where
the best thats why i bought them

that empi saying is so true

wreck - i might go to nambucca i will have to wait and see
if i get there we will definitly have to catch up if i do go