1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

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got914?
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1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by got914? » Wed Dec 31, 2014 7:18 pm

What are some of the differences ?

Im new to this type 4 thing and im reading alot on this site but wanted some info here.

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Type 4 Unleashed
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by Type 4 Unleashed » Thu Jan 01, 2015 3:11 pm

If your talking about motors out of the 914 there pretty much the same, except where some have the 2nd oil pressure relief blocked from the factory.

Motors in the Bus's & the 411 and the 412 are dimensionally the same, small differences on those are dip stick & oil fill locations, and the breather towers blocked off on some, and I believe all those have the 2nd oil pressure relief.
Richard

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Piledriver
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by Piledriver » Thu Jan 01, 2015 5:19 pm

The late Vanagon cases (`80-?) had the blocked off breather "chimney".
(NA had fewer engine options than the rest of the world)

The early cases had the second pressure control valve on the 1/2 side of the case, near the lifter bores on #1.
The later cases were set up for hydraulic lifters, and had that area plugged (actually just not machined) from the factory.
This second pressure control//relief valve can be disabled with a short metal rod in place of the piston.

Interesting thing about this valve was the piston had an ~ 1mm hole in it as a full time bleed, I think of it as an air escape path should the pickup suck some air going around a corner, rather than having to work it out via the bearings.

the 411/412 cases were all "early" style, not sure about 914 75/76 cases, they were also solid lifter.
Busses of the era were getting hydraulic lifters, at least in NA.

Jake Raby used to say the earliest cases (EA etc) had somewhat thicker castings in some areas, and the 1700/1800 and non-bus cases were most likely to be in good shape due to lower heat/loads.

Folks have used solid or hydaulic lifters in all the cases.
Hydros are discouraged due to their still requiring valve adjustments, alarming noise on startup when they leak down sitting and pick up some air, and their way of "hiding" valvetrain issues (by taking up valvetrain slack as designed) until it is too late.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

Ktk833
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by Ktk833 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 2:04 am

I'm glad this was asked and answered.
Being new to the type 4 as well, I grabbed a block that might have been manipulated a little... it has no dip-stick (I wonder how the guy checked on levels).
What are the likely spots I could find the slot of the stick? The tinware seems to have covered the first place I'd have expected to find it- at the base, next to the oil filler connection.... (or in silly question- is there a block without a dip stick??)

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raygreenwood
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by raygreenwood » Fri Aug 24, 2018 2:03 pm

Ktk833 wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 2:04 am
I'm glad this was asked and answered.
Being new to the type 4 as well, I grabbed a block that might have been manipulated a little... it has no dip-stick (I wonder how the guy checked on levels).
What are the likely spots I could find the slot of the stick? The tinware seems to have covered the first place I'd have expected to find it- at the base, next to the oil filler connection.... (or in silly question- is there a block without a dip stick??)
The 411 and 412 sedans as well as the 914's...had the short dipstick up top near the oil breather tower. The type 4 based bus engines and the 411 and 412 wagons....had a remote dipstick.

If you have a case with no dipstick up on top.....look for this....when you are looking at the fan end of the engine case...look at the lower right hand corner down near the bottom of the case and you will see about a 1" diameter hole with a mounting flange and two studs or bolt holes. This is where the dipstick mounted on those. It had a pair of rubber boots, a telescoping dipstick (at least on the 411 and 412) and it went through the sheet metal to a dipstick cap right under the rear hatch so that you did not have to lift the engine lid up to check the oil.

If you have a 914 or 411/412...you can buy a used short dipstick and tube and drill out the hole in the top of the case and install it.

Also....the later bus cases that came from teh factory as hydraulic....that got rid of the oil control valve under cylinder #1....also had a difference in the casting of the relief valve area that delivered the diverted oil back to the oil pickup area. Ray

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bajaman73
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by bajaman73 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:02 pm

Sorry for the jump in. Will 2.0L Pistons and cylinders fit in a 1700 case with no machining?
1972 VW Bus - 2.0Lw/36 Dellortos, 091 (Vacation Mode/Camping/Meets)
1967 Beetle - 1835w/40 HPMX, KCR Trans (Weekend Warrior)
1970 Ghia - (For Sale - No Engine, Needs Work)

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Piledriver
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by Piledriver » Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:00 am

bajaman73 wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:02 pm
Sorry for the jump in. Will 2.0L Pistons and cylinders fit in a 1700 case with no machining?
Yes.the cylinder bases are same size for all.
1700 heads need opened up, 100mm register vs 105mm for 1.8/2.0.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

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bajaman73
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by bajaman73 » Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:13 am

Thanks PileDriver. I have a 2L Currently with a bad crank for sure and who knows what else.. Getting a short block in pieces (all Machined or new) and going to use my top end. Hopefully..
Ever heard of a CA case? Supposedly a Replacement from Canada?
1972 VW Bus - 2.0Lw/36 Dellortos, 091 (Vacation Mode/Camping/Meets)
1967 Beetle - 1835w/40 HPMX, KCR Trans (Weekend Warrior)
1970 Ghia - (For Sale - No Engine, Needs Work)

Slow 1200
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Re: 1.7,1.8 & 2.0 case differences ?

Post by Slow 1200 » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:51 am

CA is a bus 1700, euro spec

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