My first type4, probably 2056

This is the place to discuss, or get help with any of your Type 4 questions.

Moderator: Type 4 Unleashed

Post Reply
User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 21716
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Van Alstyne, Texas

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by Piledriver » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:47 pm

Permatex, Loxeal and 3bond (and likely many others) make equivalents.

I'm sure if you know a plumber he has some of the anaerobic pipe thread sealant on his truck, industrial esp.
The patents are long expired so ~everybody can make it.

You can use the blue medium locktite thread locker, as long as you know you may need some heat if you ever need to remove a stud. The threads on both sides need to be very clean and oil free.

You really want a high strength thread locker on the cam bolts.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

User avatar
sideshow
Posts: 3206
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 2:00 pm
Location: suth'ern oraygun yusa
Contact:

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by sideshow » Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:12 pm

That old blue 243 is the standby thread locker that is used ever where...and an excellence choice for small bore threads like case side head studs or cam bolts.
The high strength is actually for larger screws/looser clearance fasteners. Side effect...harder to remove. I wouldn't go to far out of my way to purchase it.

Peening and/or JB-weld is also great for the hard to liquid thread lock tasks.
Yeah some may call it overkill, but you can't have too much overkill.

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:51 am

Thank you for the advice, I looked some more for sealant and thread locker. I found an online shop that has various Loctite products, but not the ones I requested (592 and 263).
I need feedback on what to order, because I have no experience with such products and how to choose, many seem to have similar specification. My options would be Loctite 577 and Loctite 262.
What do I use on the NPT plugs in the engine case, sealant or thread locker? I think thread locker, but which one, the medium strength Loctite 243?

Thread sealant:
Loctite 511: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, low resistance to dis-assembly, hardening, maximum thread diameter 3"
Loctite 542: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium resistance to dis-assembly, hardening, maximum thread diameter 3/4", for fine threads
Loctite 572: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium resistance to dis-assembly, hardening, maximum thread diameter 4", for coarse threads, slow hardening for repositioning of the fittings
Loctite 577: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium resistance to dis-assembly, hardening, maximum thread diameter 4", for coarse threads, useful for stainless steel and assemblies done at low temperature like outside used equipment
Loctite 586: 50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, hardening, maximum thread diameter 2", for coarse threads, slow hardenig, useful for copper and brass fittings

Thread locker:
Loctite 222: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, low resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M36, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 14Nm
Loctite 242: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, low/medium resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M36, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 14Nm
Loctite 243: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M36, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 24Nm
Loctite 262: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium/high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M25, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 38Nm
Loctite 270: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M20, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 39Nm
Loctite 271: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M25, torque for dis-assembly of M10 with no pre-tensioning: 32Nm
Loctite 276: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M20, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 55Nm
Loctite 290: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium/high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M36, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 30Nm
Loctite 2400: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, medium resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M36, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 18Nm
Loctite 2700: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M20, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 34Nm
Loctite 2701: -50 to 150 degrees Celsius, high resistance to dis-assembly, maximum thread M20, torque for dis-assembly of M10 torqued to 5Nm: 30-60Nm

User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 21716
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Van Alstyne, Texas

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by Piledriver » Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:29 am

567 thread sealant for npt and I'd consider it for head studs into block:
(Jake also likes it to seal pushrod tube orings, I prefer just polishing the holes)
http://na.henkel-adhesives.com/product- ... 7713629185
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:55 am

567 is not available, 577 seems similar?

User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 21716
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Van Alstyne, Texas

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by Piledriver » Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:06 am

577 is a runny liquid and not really close, not rated for copper/brass even..
Where are you?
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:44 am

Romania. Not all Loctite products are available here, and ordering over Ebay or Amazon doubles the price. These products are not easily available in shops because they are not known/used on a large scale. Just a few products are everywhere (like the 243). All others are mostly used in large companies, and are sold only to companies in large quantities, not to individuals. It was hard enough to find the online shop that sells in smaller quanitites and to individuals - and most of the products on the site are available after ordering, they are not in stock. I may try to find in Hungary becasue I live quite close (80Km).

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:01 am

What about 572?
Most of the plumbers do not use liquid sealant, those small bottles are too expensive for the money they take on a job. Usually they use teflon tape, or some white string, or the most common hemp tow (I do not know the term in english...). I see that the most present in shops is still 577 as thread sealant.

User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 21716
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Van Alstyne, Texas

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by Piledriver » Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:59 am

572 would work but you'll probably want to use the primer/accelerator as it is very slow cure.
Seems bizarre they would market oddball specialty stuff ~no one buys here, and not sell the bread and butter products.

Locktite is not the only game in town, there many other companies with equivalent products.

Plumbers here are legally liable for mistakes, including ~unlimited damages, so not having leaks later is a really, really good plan.
...although typically the 567 is used in an industrial setting, for the ~same reason of only having to fix it once.
I, for one, regularly embrace our new robot overlords, as I am the guy fixing the robots...

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:38 am

All right, I'll place an order for Loctite 567 from UK, I found a shop which will ship to Romania.
For the thread locker, would Loctite 270 be ok? I ask this because I would order from the same shop both products, and 262 or 263 are not available. Otherwise I can order 657 from Amazon and 262 from Romania.

User avatar
sideshow
Posts: 3206
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 2:00 pm
Location: suth'ern oraygun yusa
Contact:

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by sideshow » Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:39 am

Why not get a kit from here? https://type4store.com/products/sealant ... t-kit.html
I've used the old LN and the old T-4 store before, they are a legit vendor.
Yeah some may call it overkill, but you can't have too much overkill.

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:55 am

That's an idea. Although I prefer to order from Europe, because ordering from the US means goint to Customs to take the package, and this means a looooong queue of people everyday. Ordering from Europe is door-to-door delivery. OK, it's comfortable.
I found also 263 in another shop that will ship to Romania.

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:06 am

OK, I ordered Loctite 567 and 263. I also ordered NPT taps and corresponding drills.
I am surprised that Porsche adjusters (Mahle Wizemann 901 105 370 02) are extremely hard to find in Europe, and very expensive. I barely found two shops in Germany, on ebay, who stock these at 35Eur each. But there are tens of shops in US having these at 20-30$. How can these parts made in Europe be more expensive here? Anyway I need them, so I'll place an order in the following days.

Next plan: measure combustion chambers cc, decide what deck height I need, measure actual deck height, decide what shims I need, order many parts from CSP.
AND upload some pics to the topic, everybody likes shiny parts more than these long talks I start.

Arnoud
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 9:27 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by Arnoud » Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:07 am

Why use Porsche items when you can get the ones from Thorsten?: http://www.tp-technologie.de/produkte%2 ... h%20en.htm
And you wont need the hard to find 8X1mm rockers but just use the 10X1mm ones.

TZepeSH
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:55 am

Re: My first type4, probably 2056

Post by TZepeSH » Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:02 pm

I already have the 8mm rockers. I prefer genuine Porsche ones, a friend had some copies (maybe 10mm, but surely not fron Thorsten) and one broke during drive. Almost ruined the engine...

Post Reply