Drifting Engine

[oldskool1303]

I am in the process of disassembling my 914 1.7 engine from my super and going to go ahead and go for a high horsepower/ torque engine for drifting purposes.( high torque engine)
engine size i was considering was an 2.2 or 2366cc engine.

how much hp could I expect from these engine?

I am going to change the stroke of my 66 crank to a 71 crank
but got confused about the rods, some mechanic guy told me
type 1 rods would be an easier way to go than putting 2.0 rods is this true?

any help would be greatly appreciated

[Clatter]

If you are going to buy an aftermarket crank (and rods), then consider T1 rod journals.
If buying an aftermarket crank, might as well go bigger than stock stroke.

Before you ever consider drifting an ACVW, you _must_ have a dry sump.

I killed a motor with a 1 1/2qt. sump on a cloverleaf here in town.
The oil light coming on at WOT near redline is not a good thing....

[Wally]

The 71mm crank has a big end rod bearing that is smaller in diameter and wider than a type 1 rod. They won't fit a stock crank at all
The original rods are very strong however if treated correctly (as with all T4 components).

165-175 hp can be done fairly normally from a 2366cc, but budget about 10K in parts/machining/labor for it as well.

Google drifting and 1303RS by Christian Stelzer. He also uses a 2366 cc in those movies

Plus get a good LSD diff for your drifting wishes!

[farmer]

I thought Christians were a 2,6 (?)
Anyway he knows his stuff.

If you want to go roundabout drifting, 160-170 hp will get you far. At those speeds you do not need that much torque (but its nice to have though)
If youre considering high speed drifting, you need WAY more power. Think 250ish at least.
I have a friend that drifts with a late 80´s 911 that is "properly" set up for it. The car weighs about 200 lbs less than stock. He has a 315 hp normally aspirated 3,2 in the rear. It is sufficient, but not much more. He runs out of power in the top end of third gear, because of the car being rather heavy on the rear axle.

Yes dry sump is a must.
T

[Wally]

I thought Christians were a 2,6 (?)

Yes, now it is, but I thought it still was 2.4 when he did those circle drift vids

[farmer]

OK.
What do I know

T

[oldskool1303]

Oh yeah a Quaife LSD is definitely one of the parts on my list along with all the internal parts.
within the next month I'm going to start gathering parts for this build.

Yes dry sump is a must.
T

I've heard about dry sumps but never knew what they actually do?


I've heard of Christians 1303rs when he was in the june 2005 issue of Hot VW's, and his videos on youtube (amazing) also Udo Reichel's 2.4l as well.

In Christian's and Udo's engine details they both used stock 2.0l rods. would these be able to withstand the high revs?

[r_towle]

If you want torque, a 71mm crank wont do it.
Get a stroked crank, stick with 96mm pistons.
small pistons, long stroke....that is the torquer. You will be able to spin the tires at lower RPM's
Larger cylinders have two bad issues.
One is you need to machine the case and heads...$$$$$
Second is the sealing surface is not so good. Heat and warpage aside...it just calls for a tiny mating surface.
Any case will take the 96mm cylinders...1,8 and 2,0 liter heads will fit the jugs.
1.7 heads will need to be machined...and its almost cheaper to buy new 1.8 liter heads than to machine 1.7 liter heads for larger valves and larger jugs. Plus the port design is constrictive on the 1.7 liter heads.

RIch

[oldskool1303]

Alright I did some reading and came to a conclusion. I'm going to go ahead with a 2300cc engine. correct me if I'm wrong on the parts

78mm counterweighted crankshaft
96mm p/c ( which p/c are good)
2.0 rods
1.8 914 heads ( if I could find some, if not just might machine my 1.7 914 heads with larger valves)
9.1:1 compression (what better compression ratio should I go for?)
not sure on what cam and lifters?

Any advise would be greatly appreciated

[fusername]

I don't konw for certain, but I think you will want a lower CR (8.5 ish) and a milder duration high lift cam for low end torque? Somethign along the lines of an off road engine build, actually very close to what I plan on building . Maybe coupled with a very small turbo for an early but mild kick? I don't know how well a turbo will work for drifting, i have no idea what it calls for, but it sure would help you power needs.

[farmer]

NO! you need lots of compression and the best rate fuel to get the torque needed.
1. A 2260 is reasonably easy to build. But I would go 80 or even 82 mm stroke. (the latter is a bit@h to build though.) to get max torque.
2. What kind of hp are you aiming for ?
3. When cam, heads, exhaust are determined, THEN you can decide your CR.

A drift engine needs explosive torque from about 3000 & up.
T

[fusername]

I was thinking to keep they dynamic CR really high with a cam that closes earlier than most racing cams that the high CR motors are designed for, but like I said i don't really know what drifting needs as far as power bands go.

[oldskool1303]

NO! you need lots of compression and the best rate fuel to get the torque needed.
1. A 2260 is reasonably easy to build. But I would go 80 or even 82 mm stroke. (the latter is a bit@h to build though.) to get max torque.
2. What kind of hp are you aiming for ?
3. When cam, heads, exhaust are determined, THEN you can decide your CR.

A drift engine needs explosive torque from about 3000 & up.
T

Yeah I'm not planning on running turbo maybe in the future
I was aiming along the lines of 180 to 200 hp just to get me started

if I decide to go with a 82 mm crank with 96 p/c how much hp would it pull?

[farmer]

That´s totally impossible to answer. Anywhere from 150 to 230 hp depending on your combination of parts.

[farmer]

Speaking of drift. Some time ago I came across this skilled finnish guy. - drifting with a diesel Mercedes, - and outpowering Skylines etc. Not VW I know. But take a look here of what can be done at a reasonable price, if you know what youre doing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24afjVqm ... re=related
T